I think it depends on the context and severity, and of course, the time that has passed - but I agree with your overall point.
Director James Gunn under fire for offensive tweets [Update: Fired]
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I think it depends on the context and severity, and of course, the time that has passed - but I agree with your overall point.
- Feb 15, 2012
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This is a great point and frankly it's not new, just the medium is new.
A lot of times people get in trouble when private conversations become public, when a new side of someone comes out. But Gunn wasn't hiding this and in fact was trying to highlight how one can grow and move on. Disney didn't find a buried sex tape or something, they knew full well what they were getting into.
As I've said before, the persons raising the issues do need to be considered. Are we demanding Barr and Gunn be better out of an honest want to make the world better or some sort of perverse silencing of opposition? I see it as Gunn being targeted for unrelated comments about the president and toxic masculinity while Barr was targeted for her actual words and sentiments.
Lets flip it around, lets talk about Jimmy Fallon. It's no secret that Jimmy Fallon is conservative, he's donated to conservative candidates and his humor tends to skate around politics in general. What if a liberal conspiracy theorist was angry at Jimmy for calling out their anti-vaccination stance and decided to go through his old media (tweets, skits, stand up, etc) to find something unrelated and offensive to promote NBC to fire him. Not because his content was offensive to that liberal conspiracy theorist or unknown to NBC but to remove "opposition" and "save children" (not something they'd say out loud but their true motives). I think there would be an outcry from everyone on that, it's a total BS move and spineless by NBC.
Yes to that. I'm 68 and not the same person I was at 58 or even 48 or 38 , and certainly not at 18..........And, not referring to this Gunn case in particular, but more an overall view...What's troubling is dredging things up from the past when certain societal & cultural standards & norms may have been different. You could see a lot of this overt sensitivity reactions, loss of a sense of humor, and political correctness starting to simmer in the late 80's and 90's when certain segments of American society started to force 'their' moral and political 'view' of the world down everyone's throat. Now it's grown into these great social media and political firestorms that are dividing the country. And unfortunately social media is a huge culprit since it gives radical segments of the population, and those who want to force their vision of moral beliefs on everyone, a larger voice and much more strength than their numbers would normally allow.....The country is so much different than the America I grew up in the 50's, 60's and 70's. Certain segments have just become too sensitive, too morally full of themselves, and entirely too humorless.
There are several differences between the Roseanne situation and Gunn's.
First, what Gunn did was 8 years ago, publicly addressed, and apologized for in 2012. Before he was hired by Disney. Roseanne's problem is current and on going.
Second, the nature of the offenses are very different. Gunn made nebulous shocking JOKES. Roseanne went on a no jokes involved racist attack on a specific individual.
First, what Gunn did was 8 years ago, publicly addressed, and apologized for in 2012. Before he was hired by Disney. Roseanne's problem is current and on going.
Second, the nature of the offenses are very different. Gunn made nebulous shocking JOKES. Roseanne went on a no jokes involved racist attack on a specific individual.
Slightly off topic, but I know we've been meaning to have me on the Parkscope Podcast, sorry I kept putting it off. We should totally set that up soon!
I am not easily offended by jokes. There's maybe 2 jokes in the history of all media I have consumed in my entire life that have ever offended me. (One from SouthPark and the other Family Guy, and yet, they still remain some of my favorite shows. I know they don't mean any harm, it was just a bad joke that got to me due to personal reasons.) I realize that not every joke is for every person, or as Joe puts it, sometimes jokes punch up, are negative in nature, and are many times directed towards a group that is in a minority, (or has historically been bullied to the point where it becomes normal to bully them.)
Here's the thing though. I don't get mad at tasteless jokes that are offensive because they are offensive. I get mad because they're bad jokes.
If a joke is funny. If a joke is well constructed. Then, I believe, a joke can be made about literally anything.
The idea that nothing should be joked about can be dangerous. Just because something is no joking matter, doesn't mean it can't be part of a good joke.
In the middle ages, the only one who was allowed to speak ill of the king was the jester. Since the fool was not taken seriously, he could call those in power out for all the bad they were doing. Too much taxes for example, or "oh there King whatever goes cutting off another servant's head, that's so King whatever." People laugh, the king laughs, and it's funny because it's true. But if you're not the jester and say that, oh boy are you losing your head back then.
Jokes can be powerful tools. Jokes can help us cope with incredible sad events in our history. But also, jokes can be lazy and tweeted out in the middle of the night with little to no reflection. Offensive jokes as a whole don't upset me, poorly constructed ones do.
What was my point? Oh yea, the real crime here (or rather 8 years ago when he wrote those "jokes,") isn't how "offensive" they are. It's how bad they are as jokes. At least to me.
Being offensive for offensive's sake gives good offensive jokes a bad name.
That is so on point it's crazy. I know plenty of nurses, police officers and firefighters who laugh and joke and make light of awful situations and have a crazy dark sense of humour because if they didn't, they'd break down and wouldn't be able to function.
Look at Pete Davidson making jokes about 9/11 for example.
- Feb 2, 2018
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:x: this whole situation. I hope the galactic side of the MCU falls the :x: apart so that Disney is properly punished for this politics>art bs mindset.
If something you're reading offends you, don't read it. If something you're watching offends you, turn off the tv. Because it offends you, doesn't mean it is your right to prevent people from enjoying it.
Most of the time that's how it works. It often takes someone rallying and showing the offensive thing to as many people as they can, usually in an attempt get the work removed or the author punished.
It happened when religious groups rallied to get The Simpsons taken off the air in 1990. It happens now on Twitter. Without the organized groups leading the charge, most people would just change the channel, or unfollow the person online, and move on with their lives.
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I’d consider myself an MCU fan as well, but I can’t see myself ever caring about the galactic side of it as much as I did without Gunn at the helm.
- Feb 15, 2012
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I've been through a lot the past few years with family stuff. If I didn't have comedy I'd probably have killed myself, actually killed myself. Depression and anxiety is a real problem and all of that plus all I've been through is a ton. But I'M the one to make that joke, not someone else or James Gunn. I think that's something we need to remember here.
I don't believe this. Words are power and do have meaning. Simply ignoring them doesn't solve anything because it emboldens those with hateful views and normalizes them.
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Anyway, told you all this was going to cause more issues, guess now the same group is going after Patton Oswalt.
The jokes are horrific. No bones about them. I cringed while reading them.
However, where is the ability in our society to recognize that individuals make mistakes? They were from 8 years ago, he apologized, and life moved on. This is nothing more than a spineless caving on Disney's part.
We've run rampant with this idea that if we believe something passionately enough that other's must bow to our will. I get that the business world is different because people=money, but Disney should have handled this differently.
Idk, maybe in the way of standing FOR the reconciliation of people who need to mature, rather than cut the leg off where the pain is?
Money sells and the vehemence in which I see a lot of people acting out these days is terrifying. Temper tantrums is what it looks like.
However, where is the ability in our society to recognize that individuals make mistakes? They were from 8 years ago, he apologized, and life moved on. This is nothing more than a spineless caving on Disney's part.
We've run rampant with this idea that if we believe something passionately enough that other's must bow to our will. I get that the business world is different because people=money, but Disney should have handled this differently.
Idk, maybe in the way of standing FOR the reconciliation of people who need to mature, rather than cut the leg off where the pain is?
Money sells and the vehemence in which I see a lot of people acting out these days is terrifying. Temper tantrums is what it looks like.
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They could have Gunn be an advisor in the near future, or they can hire him back. It’s all up in the air at this point.
I really hope they keep him around somehow.
I really hope they keep him around somehow.
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