5th Hotel?

[natespf]

Universal is aggressively trying to change peoples minds about their Orlando property. Imagine if they had a resort rated by an independent review higher than anything at Disney, and if it were around the same price as Floridian. The Diamond rating system is based on aesthetics, amenities and service, not price. So rooms could start in the $500 range like some 5 Diamond properties, instead of the $1,000 range as others.

Florida has the second most 5 Diamond hotels in state, only behind California. UOR has 3 massive moderate hotels already, and a ginormous value hotel about to open. So a high end boutique would cover a higher spectrum of guests.

 

[Jakemeister]

The Waldorf is nice, I guess it is only 4 diamonds as well? I would eat at Bull and Bear there before I would eat at Shula's. They have an incredible place for breakfast at the Waldorf as well, but way out of my price range for breakfast.

Waldorf Astoria is only 4 Diamonds as well. A lot of REALLY good Orlando properties are 4 Diamond. That being said I really think the leap needs to be made, the market is clearly there. Especially with people paying as much for the "elegance" of 4 Diamond Disney properties. Just go the extra mile.

 

[Skubersky]

Sorry but Disney already took this one: it's the Canada pavilion at Epcot! ;-)

 

[TylerDurden]

Ritz-Carlton in Orlando has seen quite a bit of success, as have the rest of the 4 diamond properties. The Ritz is the closest you're getting to 5 Diamond though. I think 4 Seasons might change that, but that isn't even a guarantee.

Joke if you want but I think there is a real market for 5 Diamond in Orlando. It would obviously come with upscale restaurants if it happened. These people are already staying in Orlando, that's why there are so many 4 Diamond resorts in Orange County. The people staying at the Ritz, Grand Floridian, and J.W. Marriott are close to paying 5 Diamond prices as is, there money is ready, they'd more than likely pay the little bit more to stay.

The JW and Ritz draw a majority of their business from convention attendees and business travelers. Like it has been said, a 5 diamond resort is not going to attract a whole lot of families who travel to theme parks for vacation. Obviously, there is some market for it, seeing as the Grand Floridian and Portofino do good business, but going a step above that is really pushing it.

 

[Jakemeister]

Eh, I think the business crowd is staying close to the convention center. That's why Rosen Centre, Hyatt Regency and Hilton are able to get away with $300 a night rooms. I think Ritz is going a lot more for the golf crowd.

 

[TylerDurden]

^That too, but I tend to lump them in with businessmen . Also, the convention center connecting the two hotels is huge, there are definitely events going on year-round that draw a sizeable crowd...moreso them than Disney vacationers.

 

[Disneyhead]

The Grand FL has 867 rooms starting at $700+/night and The Poly has 847 rooms starting at $600+/night. I am pretty sure that a 300 room 5 Star resort with its own spa and real gourmet dining would be pretty popular. Particularly if they could keep it around $550/night during high season.

 

[TylerDurden]

I agree with that. Luxurious yet small enough to satisfy a smaller crowd.

 

[natespf]

^ & ^^ That's what I was thinking. With a smaller resort it would be more intimate, where they can pay the proper level of attention to every detail. We have seen them launch the concept of a 'value resort' to a whole new level. It would be a huge investment and there is some jumping through hoops to get the proper rating. But I think it would pay off in the end, even with more reasonable prices.

If that is what they go for, I think the Hollywood theme would be a good fit. I know there is a way less cheesy way of saying it, but a place where everyone feels like a celebrity.

 

[Jakemeister]

When I mentioned 5 Diamond I wasn't referring to some 1200 room resort like Hyatt Orlando. Something smaller with a elegant boutique vibe. Maybe a tower with 300 rooms, roof access for cinesphere and a pool. Restaurant on top floor and if the room is there a golf course.

 

[Disneyhead]

How about an old Hollywood theme. Make it look like The Beverly Wilshire Hotel:

 

[Gambit]

How about an old Hollywood theme. Make it look like The Beverly Wilshire Hotel:

But they already have one of those.

But seriously, I really think an old school Hollywood hotel would be an awesome way to go. Super classy.

 

[DufflesMcGee]

I believe 5-diamond hotels are built for international luxury and business travelers, not middle-class families going to a swamp on vacation. I'm joking... Well, I'm not really joking, but point is: I don't think the central Florida market can support a 5-diamond hotel. People that pay $900 a night won't be seen eating.... Burger Sushi.

Yes it can, from the international travelers with money who come to Orlando and want to stay in the best hotels. There are enough of these to make it successful

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Keep in mind that Uni's open resorts are 4 Diamond, I believe the new one will be 3 Diamond. So if the do build a 5 Diamond it would probably be comparable with Floridian in price.

Oneupmanship at it's finest.

--- Low Mid Hi
Dis 2* 3* 4*
Uni 3* 4* 5*

Like I said, yes the will build one, not on the current spot they have now

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Ritz-Carlton in Orlando has seen quite a bit of success, as have the rest of the 4 diamond properties. The Ritz is the closest you're getting to 5 Diamond though. I think 4 Seasons might change that, but that isn't even a guarantee.

Joke if you want but I think there is a real market for 5 Diamond in Orlando. It would obviously come with upscale restaurants if it happened. These people are already staying in Orlando, that's why there are so many 4 Diamond resorts in Orange County. The people staying at the Ritz, Grand Floridian, and J.W. Marriott are close to paying 5 Diamond prices as is, there money is ready, they'd more than likely pay the little bit more to stay.

Yes, there is no doubting the market is here, it has been here since WDW first opened.

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Universal is aggressively trying to change peoples minds about their Orlando property. Imagine if they had a resort rated by an independent review higher than anything at Disney, and if it were around the same price as Floridian. The Diamond rating system is based on aesthetics, amenities and service, not price. So rooms could start in the $500 range like some 5 Diamond properties, instead of the $1,000 range as others.

Florida has the second most 5 Diamond hotels in state, only behind California. UOR has 3 massive moderate hotels already, and a ginormous value hotel about to open. So a high end boutique would cover a higher spectrum of guests.

You said it yourself, and apart of aesthetics is not hearing trucks go by, tights land space and being able to look out your window and not see other hotels. Thats what makes grand floridian pristine. You won't get a 5 diamond on that piece of land

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Eh, I think the business crowd is staying close to the convention center. That's why Rosen Centre, Hyatt Regency and Hilton are able to get away with $300 a night rooms. I think Ritz is going a lot more for the golf crowd.

There is definitely something to look forward to near the convention center post 2020

Btw, I know this isn't the layout that would be used for Uni if it goes thru*****

 

[Jakemeister]

Something else fun to speculate over is the cool amenities for the parks that would be offered. Obviously if it was being marketed as even higher end then their Deluxe Resorts it would need something to differentiate it's self. Free Express and Early Entry wouldn't cut it. Makes you wonder what type of things would be offered. Probably wouldn't happen, but it would be REALLY cool if for every 3 nights you stayed you got a VIP Tour or something along those lines.

 

[DufflesMcGee]

Something else fun to speculate over is the cool amenities for the parks that would be offered. Obviously if it was being marketed as even higher end then their Deluxe Resorts it would need something to differentiate it's self. Free Express and Early Entry wouldn't cut it. Makes you wonder what type of things would be offered. Probably wouldn't happen, but it would be REALLY cool if for every 3 nights you stayed you got a VIP Tour or something along those lines.

VIP rest area with free food within each park? Kind of like a nice club 33 (or 23) within both parks? I think that would suffice. That plus maybe a few free drinks in citywalk, priority seating for fireworks. If we are talking new area (where 5 diamond would be), better restaurants, priority system of some sort, Free poller coaster rides? golf range.... Possibilities are endless with more attractions/services

 

[Jakemeister]

VIP rest area with free food within each park? Kind of like a nice club 33 (or 23) within both parks? I think that would suffice. That plus maybe a few free drinks in citywalk, priority seating for fireworks. If we are talking new area (where 5 diamond would be), better restaurants, priority system of some sort, Free poller coaster rides? golf range.... Possibilities are endless with more attractions/services

I completely agree. Disney doesn't offer sh** for Grand guest except in room merch delivery and a few other things. Free golf makes since, obviously an elite concierge service. I like the rest area notion and Universal already has shown they do too since they did it for AmEx holders.

 

[DufflesMcGee]

I completely agree. Disney doesn't offer sh** for Grand guest except in room merch delivery and a few other things. Free golf makes since, obviously an elite concierge service. I like the rest area notion and Universal already has shown they do too since they did it for AmEx holders.

If universal makes a 5 diamond resort, it won't be the fact that its 5 diamond that will bring visitors to the resort, it will be the added amenities and perks that becomes the main decision maker to high paying tourist.

Express pass, an hour (maybe an hour and a half?) earlier into the parks, free water bottles, complementary food/beverage (When I stayed in a high end hotel in cancun, they actually left different deserts and a complementary wine/champagne or beer pairing to go along with it. They said they try to hae no two deserts the same in a month, why hasn't something so simple been seen in $500+ per night hotels?!). What I also would feel would be a great idea is pick up from airport (Jaguar, crystler - not a crappy bus), the rest lounge in-parks with full bar and massage room (this obviously cant be free - maybe first drink free and 10 minute shoulder massage).

If you can get those things down, I'll pay more for that than staying in the grand floridian.

 

[UniversalCityFL]

Yes, there are JW Marriots and Ritz Carltons in Orlando. Keep in mind these are for international business travelers who are most likely in Orlando for trade conventions and their companies are paying for their lodging. These are not family vacations.

Orlando, Florida is not one of the premiere vacation destinations in the world for affluent families. Prices above the Portofino level aren't really realistic for the market, in my opinion. People who have MONEY to spend will vacation in Paris or Bal Harbor or St. Thomas -- places where you don't have to stand in lines or be around the general public. UO is fun marketed towards the middle class and isn't really on the map for the 5-star set.

The Grand Floridian is a bit of an exception since they have a large convention business and wedding business, so they can get away with the higher prices for these once-in-a-lifetime events.

So again, I do not believe UO can support an even more expensive hotel. The ONLY way I can see it working is, as TylerDurden mentioned, doing some sort of small boutique hotel situation. I can see maybe 20 small villas adjacent to the RPR that shares staffing with the RPR.

 

[Disneyhead]

I couldn't disagree more. I believe there is very much of a market for luxury resorts in the destination theme park game. Disney has over 3,000 rooms that NEVER cost less than $500/night. And based on amenities, even The Grand Floridian is barely above a 3 star. As a matter of fact, the last year Mobil Travel rated it it was only a 3 star. A true 5 star in the $500/$550 ballpark that has around 300 rooms would slay!

and for those that say a 5 Star can't be built on that plot because of nearby hotels and highway noise. Manhattan has 104 5 star hotels each with limited space and city noise.

 

[Teebin]

I couldn't disagree more. I believe there is very much of a market for luxury resorts in the destination theme park game. Disney has over 3,000 rooms that NEVER cost less than $500/night. And based on amenities, even The Grand Floridian is barely above a 3 star. As a matter of fact, the last year Mobil Travel rated it it was only a 3 star. A true 5 star in the $500/$550 ballpark that has around 300 rooms would slay!

and for those that say a 5 Star can't be built on that plot because of nearby hotels and highway noise. Manhattan has 104 5 star hotels each with limited space and city noise.

I completely agree with you. Multimillionaires like theme parks too, but they also like being pampered in unimaginable ways in their home away from home.