Volcano Bay Construction & Preview Discussion

[Scott W.]

Yea, the representative pretty much verified this is about VB when I asked in an email.

Do we still think it's about the tallest drop slide thing, or did we think something else?

They'll be able to brand the tall slide in however many ways, even as new slides are built; Tallest trap door slide in the world, tallest freefall body slide in the US, tallest slide in Orlando.

I'd have thought that the announcement would be about the water coaster but a record breaking ride is probably going to get more press.

 

[Joel]

Magic Bands vs TapuTapu is pretty trivial. TapuTapu can do more. But Disney isn't and wasn't concerned with how efficient FP+ was w/ the Magic Band nearly as much as they were concerned with crowd sourcing. Which, in turn, allows them to adjust staffing, ride ops, etc and make more money than they could have dreamed by reducing operating costs.

Park admission, dining, payment, room key, FP+, park-wide Wifi infrastructure, etc, etc- while it seems like a nice convenience was done so they can keep tabs on you in one concise program. Tiered pricing with efficient labor/ride allocation is leaps and bounds more advanced than Universal's. It's not even close. Crowds can "appear" less busy- because there are less people- yet wait times remain the same because they are able to adjust not only in real-time but with weeks of preparation.

The "business" aspect of FP/MM+ was brilliant. It seemed dumb at the time to spend a billion plus- one that people argued should have been spent on new rides- but it was never about "increasing crowds". It was always about getting more money from people "efficiently"- all while reducing operating costs. They've more than recouped their billion and are laughing all the way to the bank now.


As for TapuTapu- it's strictly a convenience factor for now. Long-term, I'd expect Universal to follow in Disney's footsteps as it has proven very successful financially.

..like that last thing there about intelligence?

 

[Mad Dog]

Magic Bands vs TapuTapu is pretty trivial. TapuTapu can do more. But Disney isn't and wasn't concerned with how efficient FP+ was w/ the Magic Band nearly as much as they were concerned with crowd sourcing. Which, in turn, allows them to adjust staffing, ride ops, etc and make more money than they could have dreamed by reducing operating costs.

Park admission, dining, payment, room key, FP+, park-wide Wifi infrastructure, etc, etc- while it seems like a nice convenience was done so they can keep tabs on you in one concise program. Tiered pricing with efficient labor/ride allocation is leaps and bounds more advanced than Universal's. It's not even close. Crowds can "appear" less busy- because there are less people- yet wait times remain the same because they are able to adjust not only in real-time but with weeks of preparation.

The "business" aspect of FP/MM+ was brilliant. It seemed dumb at the time to spend a billion plus- one that people argued should have been spent on new rides- but it was never about "increasing crowds". It was always about getting more money from people "efficiently"- all while reducing operating costs. They've more than recouped their billion and are laughing all the way to the bank now.


As for TapuTapu- it's strictly a convenience factor for now. Long-term, I'd expect Universal to follow in Disney's footsteps as it has proven very successful financially.

I don't agree with that assessment. When Disney was rolling out the Magic band program, Iger was touting the expected financial windfalls of the program at the Quarterly investment meetings. But since it's rollout, he avoids answering any specifics concerning the financials around it at every Quarterly meeting. If it was truly successful, for sure he would be throwing those numbers out to investors instead of going dead silent. And, even more telling is that the three principles involved with the fiasco, Franklin, Russulo & Staggs have been forced out since the implementation.

 

[JoeCamel]

I don't agree with that assessment. When Disney was rolling out the Magic band program, Iger was touting the expected financial windfalls of the program at the Quarterly investment meetings. But since it's rollout, he avoids answering any specifics concerning the financials around it at every Quarterly meeting. If it was truly successful, for sure he would be throwing those numbers out to investors instead of going dead silent. And, even more telling is that the three principles involved with the fiasco, Franklin, Russulo & Staggs have been forced out since the implementation.

I believe Parentof4 over on Magic would agree with you. He does understand the numbers

 

[Scott W.]

I don't agree with that assessment. When Disney was rolling out the Magic band program, Iger was touting the expected financial windfalls of the program at the Quarterly investment meetings. But since it's rollout, he avoids answering any specifics concerning the financials around it at every Quarterly meeting. If it was truly successful, for sure he would be throwing those numbers out to investors instead of going dead silent. And, even more telling is that the three principles involved with the fiasco, Franklin, Russulo & Staggs have been forced out since the implementation.

To add to the success part slightly. If it was a success, it would be rolled out to every other resort.

 

[Andysol]

..like that last thing there about intelligence?

Yes- while "Real Time" is great- 30/60 and 180 day projections are even better. Universal has to upgrade their infrastructure before it can be close to what Disney's is. It will be easier, of course, due to the size and scope of universal vs WDW.

I don't agree with that assessment. When Disney was rolling out the Magic band program, Iger was touting the expected financial windfalls of the program at the Quarterly investment meetings. But since it's rollout, he avoids answering any specifics concerning the financials around it at every Quarterly meeting. If it was truly successful, for sure he would be throwing those numbers out to investors instead of going dead silent. And, even more telling is that the three principles involved with the fiasco, Franklin, Russulo & Staggs have been forced out since the implementation.

During the end of January- you could go to a relatively slow park that had a fraction of the July crowds- yet wait times weren't significantly different. Gone are the "walk on" days. Sure, you might find one here and there- but analyzing the wait times for 2015-2016 since the implementation of tiers and MM+ having years of data- there is no discernible difference in the amount of rides one can do on January 25th vs July 25th. Try that at Universal. Or Try that at Disney in 2013. And it's all money saved on the back-end. Just 1 side of Dumbo running until 11am-12pm. Just 2 cars running on BTMR or Everest. A severe cut in staff for x park on x day or x restaurant or x store. Less fastpasses available for slow days, etc. The projections are incredible and again- in analyzing the wait times- its remarkable how similar they are now (not taking into account ride closures of course).
That has never been the case before MM+. Now the best you get for a "slow time of year" are less crowded walkways.

To add to the success part slightly. If it was a success, it would be rolled out to every other resort.

No other park is a week-long destination. TDL is the closest they have- and thats 4 days max (literally- you cant buy a 5 day)

 

[Mad Dog]

Yes- while "Real Time" is great- 30/60 and 180 day projections are even better. Universal has to upgrade their infrastructure before it can be close to what Disney's is. It will be easier, of course, due to the size and scope of universal vs WDW.


During the end of January- you could go to a relatively slow park that had a fraction of the July crowds- yet wait times weren't significantly different. Gone are the "walk on" days. Sure, you might find one here and there- but analyzing the wait times for 2015-2016 since the implementation of tiers and MM+ having years of data- there is no discernible difference in the amount of rides one can do on January 25th vs July 25th. Try that at Universal. Or Try that at Disney in 2013. And it's all money saved on the back-end. Just 1 side of Dumbo running until 11am-12pm. Just 2 cars running on BTMR or Everest. A severe cut in staff for x park on x day or x restaurant or x store. Less fastpasses available for slow days, etc. The projections are incredible and again- in analyzing the wait times- its remarkable how similar they are now (not taking into account ride closures of course).
That has never been the case before MM+. Now the best you get for a "slow time of year" are less crowded walkways.


No other park is a week-long destination. TDL is the closest they have- and thats 4 days max (literally- you cant buy a 5 day)

Yes, but that doesn't have a lot to do with My Magic. Those figures were always available to them previously. They could have adjusted then, and did to a lesser extent. But they had a different philosophy. Now they've gone into full cost cutting mode, slashed staffing, cut live entertainment, cut food portions etc. . Before they were concerned with the total customer experience, not so now....And Fastpass Plus ended up making the stand by lines significantly longer according to Touring Plans even before the staffing cuts that came on the heels of Shanghai cost overruns. ....as Joe Camel stated above, check Parents of 4 posts on the subject. He's the statistical expert over at WDW Magic.

 

[JoeCamel]

Yes- while "Real Time" is great- 30/60 and 180 day projections are even better. Universal has to upgrade their infrastructure before it can be close to what Disney's is. It will be easier, of course, due to the size and scope of universal vs WDW.


During the end of January- you could go to a relatively slow park that had a fraction of the July crowds- yet wait times weren't significantly different. Gone are the "walk on" days. Sure, you might find one here and there- but analyzing the wait times for 2015-2016 since the implementation of tiers and MM+ having years of data- there is no discernible difference in the amount of rides one can do on January 25th vs July 25th. Try that at Universal. Or Try that at Disney in 2013. And it's all money saved on the back-end. Just 1 side of Dumbo running until 11am-12pm. Just 2 cars running on BTMR or Everest. A severe cut in staff for x park on x day or x restaurant or x store. Less fastpasses available for slow days, etc. The projections are incredible and again- in analyzing the wait times- its remarkable how similar they are now (not taking into account ride closures of course).
That has never been the case before MM+. Now the best you get for a "slow time of year" are less crowded walkways.


No other park is a week-long destination. TDL is the closest they have- and thats 4 days max (literally- you cant buy a 5 day)

I see what you are saying but it is very short sighted to use it that way. The GS is horrible with everyone saying it is too crowded, too much to plan, too expensive etc. They may make back the money but the damage to long term business will take decades to undo.

I hope Universal is watching closely all the impacts of MM+ and don't go down the same road. The catch phrase today is "we are a numbers driven business" but that leaves out so many important intangibles that contribute to long term success. If Tapu Tapu turns out to be the same thing I might have to seek real adventures and eschew the themed worlds in the future.

 

[Scott W.]

I don't think any of these have been posted yet:

 

[Scott W.]

 

[Scott W.]

 

[Andysol]

check Parents of 4 posts on the subject. He's the statistical expert over at WDW Magic.

im a Parents of 4 fanboy... I love his posts :thumbsup:

 

[quinnmac000]

oh wait, they slides are in rockwork now? So much for 'unthemed" slides.

 

[Nick]

To add to the success part slightly. If it was a success, it would be rolled out to every other resort.

Well, with MaxPass, they are installing the infrastructure that MM+ uses at Disneyland. There's also rumors of a version of it at DLP.

 

[Scott W.]

Well, with MaxPass, they are installing the infrastructure that MM+ uses at Disneyland. There's also rumors of a version of it at DLP.

I'd be very much in favour of that. Using the old system in Paris, it sucks.

 

[USO92]

oh wait, they slides are in rockwork now? So much for 'unthemed" slides.

This spurred my thinking:

I was perusing through Bioreconstruct's page and saw some of typhoon lagoon's refurb pics floating around. It reminded me of why I love that water park. In contrast to Volcano Bae, TL built their slides (with the exception of CrushnGusher) into the landscape. Very rarely do you see supports or the like...

For me, it blends reality with the fantasy. It makes it a smooth connection with believing what you're seeing. Almost as if the slides are an extension of the land itself.

I'm stoked for VB. However, I resonate with some who said the slide layouts look...basic. I will ride it all and withhold judgment until I do, but I can't say that my expectations are lower.

Thoughts?

 

[Quake_27]

While I agree that Typhoons aesthetic is more visually pleasing by hiding the support structures... one could argue that by exposing them (as Volcano Bay has) the perceived sense of danger and thrill is heightend as you see the height and scope of the slides. That is much more in-line with Universals "thrill" audience and park design approach.

 

[USO92]

While I agree that Typhoons aesthetic is more visually pleasing by hiding the support structures... one could argue that by exposing them (as Volcano Bay has) the perceived sense of danger and thrill is heightend as you see the height and scope of the slides. That is much more in-line with Universals "thrill" audience and park design approach.

I agree completely. I love looking at the drop slides inside of Krakatau and wondering what it's going to be like to ride those suckers. I wouldn't be surprised, at this point, if I got there in June and experienced all of it in its glory but still gave TL the leg up on aesthetics.

I'm open to anything honestly.

Also, welcome to OU!

 

[Scott W.]

This spurred my thinking:

I was perusing through Bioreconstruct's page and saw some of typhoon lagoon's refurb pics floating around. It reminded me of why I love that water park. In contrast to Volcano Bae, TL built their slides (with the exception of CrushnGusher) into the landscape. Very rarely do you see supports or the like...

For me, it blends reality with the fantasy. It makes it a smooth connection with believing what you're seeing. Almost as if the slides are an extension of the land itself.

I'm stoked for VB. However, I resonate with some who said the slide layouts look...basic. I will ride it all and withhold judgment until I do, but I can't say that my expectations are lower.

Thoughts?

I still think it's a little too soon to say. We still don't really know how it's going to look from ground level. We're outside looking in when all that really matters is inside looking out.

 

[USO92]

I still think it's a little too soon to say. We still don't really know how it's going to look from ground level. We're outside looking in when all that really matters is inside looking out.

Agreed! I'm definitely withholding complete judgment because I'm sure it will look great when finished. It's just a mess of construction right now.