Brightline Station Coming to Orlando

[tielo]

I’m under the impression that this was to protect the trains from what will be a reckoning for Branson and his assets. This project is plowing forward, and the fact that a recession and pandemic wasn’t even able to stop it makes me very happy.

As long as this isn't build and open I would temper any enthusiasm you have over this project.

 

[Magic Feather]

As long as this isn't build and open I would temper any enthusiasm you have over this project.

There has been a lot of physical construction. On many sections of the route, they are all but ready for track, some already have track too. If this project was stopped, it would not take much (mostly just laying track) to finish it.

 

[Happytycho]

There has been a lot of physical construction. On many sections of the route, they are all but ready for track, some already have track too. If this project was stopped, it would not take much (mostly just laying track) to finish it.

Yeah I think the Miami-Orlando line will make it to opening.

Don't hold your breath on the Disney/Tampa extension though.

 

[Happytycho]

Here's a mix of general Brightline updates:

Brightline recently posted their quarterly report for the quarter ended 6/30/20, and it states that in Q2 of 2020 they had a smaller operating loss than in Q2 of 2019, which is particularly notable because they suspended all service in March and therefore ran zero trains in Q2 2020. This does not appear to be especially encouraging for a quick restart of the south Florida service.

Brightline is also negotiating with Miami-Dade for a new commuter service to run on their line in south Florida. This has been somewhat controversial, because it's basically Brightline asking for a tax handout. Here is an interesting article about recent developments: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/article245981730.html

Regarding what this thread is really about, the latest quarterly report states that they are "Continuing to advance development of a station on Disney property in Orlando." They have given some indications of trying to do Disney before going all the way to Tampa, but I believe they will at least need to have firm plans for the Tampa route and all right of way agreements in place before they can start building to Disney. These agreements still seem a while off, but they have recently signed a non-binding MOU for potential station locations in Tampa, which indicates the project is still progressing (albeit slowly): https://www.bizjournals.com/tampaba...tline-darryl-shaw-ybor-city-rail-station.html

Meanwhile, construction continues all across the extension from West Palm Beach to Orlando, including with a somewhat unique construction method recently used in building a grade separation at Goldenrod Rd.: Brightline’s track construction pushes train tunnel under Orlando’s Goldenrod Road

Over on the west coast, Brightline's California to Las Vegas project has had its schedule slip, but Forbes just reported that they plan to move forward with offering $3.2 billion bonds in the near future so that construction can start as early as this year for an opening in 2024: https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2020/09/25/rail-startup-brightline-kicks-off-32-billion-bond-sale-for-la-to-vegas-high-speed-train/

 

[Magic Feather]

Here's a mix of general Brightline updates:

Brightline recently posted their quarterly report for the quarter ended 6/30/20, and it states that in Q2 of 2020 they had a smaller operating loss than in Q2 of 2019, which is particularly notable because they suspended all service in March and therefore ran zero trains in Q2 2020. This does not appear to be especially encouraging for a quick restart of the south Florida service.

Brightline is also negotiating with Miami-Dade for a new commuter service to run on their line in south Florida. This has been somewhat controversial, because it's basically Brightline asking for a tax handout. Here is an interesting article about recent developments: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/article245981730.html

Regarding what this thread is really about, the latest quarterly report states that they are "Continuing to advance development of a station on Disney property in Orlando." They have given some indications of trying to do Disney before going all the way to Tampa, but I believe they will at least need to have firm plans for the Tampa route and all right of way agreements in place before they can start building to Disney. These agreements still seem a while off, but they have recently signed a non-binding MOU for potential station locations in Tampa, which indicates the project is still progressing (albeit slowly): https://www.bizjournals.com/tampaba...tline-darryl-shaw-ybor-city-rail-station.html

Meanwhile, construction continues all across the extension from West Palm Beach to Orlando, including with a somewhat unique construction method recently used in building a grade separation at Goldenrod Rd.: Brightline’s track construction pushes train tunnel under Orlando’s Goldenrod Road

Over on the west coast, Brightline's California to Las Vegas project has had its schedule slip, but Forbes just reported that they plan to move forward with offering $3.2 billion bonds in the near future so that construction can start as early as this year for an opening in 2024: Rail Startup Brightline Kicks Off $3.2 Billion Bond Sale For LA-To-Vegas High-Speed Train

People have had their doubts, but the WPB-Orlando Leg is really happening for once. At a bare minimum this leg is getting done in the next two years.
Personally, I don’t see Brightline or Disney making the Disney station contingent on the Tampa leg. It’s really in nobody’s best interest to wait, especially when the Tampa leg seems to be in much greater flux compared to the Disney one.

 

[JoeCamel]

People have had their doubts, but the WPB-Orlando Leg is really happening for once. At a bare minimum this leg is getting done in the next two years.
Personally, I don’t see Brightline or Disney making the Disney station contingent on the Tampa leg. It’s really in nobody’s best interest to wait, especially when the Tampa leg seems to be in much greater flux compared to the Disney one.

I'm not sure how official or related any of it was but when high speed rail came up they did replace a couple of bridges , do the soil testing, do the survey and generally cleaned up the median in anticipation of construction of rail there at some point. I think the only real hang up is where to put the Tampa end and does Lakeland get a station?

 

[Magic Feather]

I'm not sure how official or related any of it was but when high speed rail came up they did replace a couple of bridges , do the soil testing, do the survey and generally cleaned up the median in anticipation of construction of rail there at some point. I think the only real hang up is where to put the Tampa end and does Lakeland get a station?

True. IIRC, the entire I-4 median from Tampa to Disney has always been partly earmarked for eventual high speed rail (and it has enough space for it).

 

[Happytycho]

People have had their doubts, but the WPB-Orlando Leg is really happening for once. At a bare minimum this leg is getting done in the next two years.
Personally, I don’t see Brightline or Disney making the Disney station contingent on the Tampa leg. It’s really in nobody’s best interest to wait, especially when the Tampa leg seems to be in much greater flux compared to the Disney one.

It's not Brightline or Disney that would want the Disney station contingent on Tampa, but rather FDOT who might want it. FDOT has put a lot into creating and preserving the I-4 median for HSR to Tampa, and they might not want Brightline to ruin that opportunity by using just a few miles to get to Disney with no commitment of going the rest of the way to Tampa.

 

[Happytycho]

It seems there has been a development on this project.

Based on a presentation at a Seminole County Board meeting, Brightline is trying to start discussions with the SunRail people about also using Brightline's planned MCO-Disney-Tampa intercity rail line for a commuter/SunRail type operation between the airport and Disney with a few intermediate stops, including at the existing Meadow Woods SunRail station. A SunRail vote on an MOU to begin formal discussion about potential interest and service opportunities is planned for late this month.

They even made a map:

Although it's clear that this map is very non-specific, it does seem that the Disney station is depicted at Disney Springs. This would make a lot of sense, as it could allow for a seamless connection to an already existing resort bus system along with the attraction of Disney Springs itself.

Brightline indicated that they are still very early in the process at only 15% design plans and just starting the environmental review process, so completion is currently scheduled for no earlier than 2025. Funding may also be an issue, as they didn't identify any besides a "[Federal] Infrastructure bill expected by 1Q 2021"

 

[Legacy]

Now we just one running along the 408 from UCF to Universal with a stop downtown.

 

[Magic Feather]

It seems there has been a development on this project.

Based on a presentation at a Seminole County Board meeting, Brightline is trying to start discussions with the SunRail people about also using Brightline's planned MCO-Disney-Tampa intercity rail line for a commuter/SunRail type operation between the airport and Disney with a few intermediate stops, including at the existing Meadow Woods SunRail station. A SunRail vote on an MOU to begin formal discussion about potential interest and service opportunities is planned for late this month.

They even made a map:

Although it's clear that this map is very non-specific, it does seem that the Disney station is depicted at Disney Springs. This would make a lot of sense, as it could allow for a seamless connection to an already existing resort bus system along with the attraction of Disney Springs itself.

Brightline indicated that they are still very early in the process at only 15% design plans and just starting the environmental review process, so completion is currently scheduled for no earlier than 2025. Funding may also be an issue, as they didn't identify any besides a "[Federal] Infrastructure bill expected by 1Q 2021"

I’m still under the impression that the station was/is planned to be near ESPN WWOS and FLO.

 

[darkridelover]

I'm against using public land and funding to benefit one business at the expense of every other business and attraction in Orlando.

 

[Scott W.]

Here's an overlay with the proposed map and Google Earth.

 

[GAcoaster]

I wouldn't read too much into the location of the dot. They drew a line to the edge of the property...it's probably up to Disney where they would actually put a station on property. I'd guess they have had plans in place for the best placement of a rail station for many years now and figured out how to best connect it to the rest of the property.

 

[Scott W.]

I wouldn't read too much into the location of the dot. They drew a line to the edge of the property...it's probably up to Disney where they would actually put a station on property. I'd guess they have had plans in place for the best placement of a rail station for many years now and figured out how to best connect it to the rest of the property.

The train map is fairly accurate with the roads and airport location. Using the circumference of the monorail at Epcot, it could loop around in this area if you redirect the road in and out of Typhoon Lagoon.



It does make sense to use this as a location. If you're checking out of your room at 11 and your flight is after 3pm, giving guests the option of walking around Disney Springs for dining and last minute shopping is an easy way to make money. Plus you have the bus service already servicing the area. Virgin Atlantic have been doing something similar for years.

Virgin Check in

Disney, Florida & UK Holiday Planning

thedibb.com

 

[Happytycho]

I'm against using public land and funding to benefit one business at the expense of every other business and attraction in Orlando.

Expanding SunRail like this would require approval from almost every government agency and county in Central Florida, so if you're an Orlando area local there should be plenty of opportunities to make your voice heard.

The train map is fairly accurate with the roads and airport location. Using the circumference of the monorail at Epcot, it could loop around in this area if you redirect the road in and out of Typhoon Lagoon.

View attachment 13360

It does make sense to use this as a location. If you're checking out of your room at 11 and your flight is after 3pm, giving guests the option of walking around Disney Springs for dining and last minute shopping is an easy way to make money. Plus you have the bus service already servicing the area. Virgin Atlantic have been doing something similar for years.

Virgin Check in

Disney, Florida & UK Holiday Planning

thedibb.com

The circles aren't that accurate to station locations - on your map the airport circle is about a mile from the actual Brightline airport station. I do agree that Disney Springs makes the most sense for a station location at WDW, although I think being on the east side of the Team Disney building would give a better connection to the existing bus loop. Also, I suspect that if Brightline does have their station at Disney Springs it will be a stub-end station rather than one with a turnaround because Brightline runs trainsets with locomotives on both ends and they can just tell SunRail to deal with it.

 

[Scott W.]

Expanding SunRail like this would require approval from almost every government agency and county in Central Florida, so if you're an Orlando area local there should be plenty of opportunities to make your voice heard.


The circles aren't that accurate to station locations - on your map the airport circle is about a mile from the actual Brightline airport station. I do agree that Disney Springs makes the most sense for a station location at WDW, although I think being on the east side of the Team Disney building would give a better connection to the existing bus loop. Also, I suspect that if Brightline does have their station at Disney Springs it will be a stub-end station rather than one with a turnaround because Brightline runs trainsets with locomotives on both ends and they can just tell SunRail to deal with it.

The circles might not be stations but locations. Looking at the map again, the blue line does end at Disney.

 

[Happytycho]

The Sunrail vote on partnering with Brightline planned for this morning was pulled from the agenda, per OBJ:
https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando...-sunrail-airport-connection-vote-delayed.html

This feels like an unsurprising outcome for a planned partnership between two almost dumpster fires.

 

[Magic Feather]

The Sunrail vote on partnering with Brightline planned for this morning was pulled from the agenda, per OBJ:
https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando...-sunrail-airport-connection-vote-delayed.html

This feels like an unsurprising outcome for a planned partnership between two almost dumpster fires.

I know rail in Florida has historically been (makes fart noise), but Brightline has been a real bright spot. Sure they've had a slight delay here and there, but they already consistently operate two legs and have work well underway on the West Palm to Orlando leg. Not even a pandemic and economic collapse was able to stop it, which is really impressive.

Sunrail on the other hand...

 

[WAJAS]

The Sunrail vote on partnering with Brightline planned for this morning was pulled from the agenda, per OBJ:
https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando...-sunrail-airport-connection-vote-delayed.html

This feels like an unsurprising outcome for a planned partnership between two almost dumpster fires.

It will be discussed at the next meeting in January. It was expected that the meeting would be dominated by the Phase 2 North funding discussions, which had an imminent deadline.
From the statements made by the officials, it seems they’re likely to approve the partnership.