Dark Universe - General Discussion Thread

[Clive]

I highly approve of this Easter egg:

(Though why Dark Universe's Pretorius looks like the movie actor when none of the Monsters really do is probably a question Universal doesn't want me asking!)

There's an answer to this question but it does arguably constitute a spoiler for the plot/queue of Monsters Unchained...

Spoiler: Monsters Unchained spoilers

We can see the Boris Karloff version of the Monster in the Unchained queue. Victoria Frankenstein promises to create a "better" monster, which heavily implies the original line of Monsters did exist -- the ones we encounter now, in the present, are basically the "next generation" of them (Dracula is still Dracula, but his look has evolved). So, all that said, Pretorius appearing like he does in Bride of Frankenstein makes some sense within the internal logic of the area.

 

[belloq87]

There's an answer to this question but it does arguably constitute a spoiler for the plot/queue of Monsters Unchained...

Spoiler: Monsters Unchained spoilers

We can see the Boris Karloff version of the Monster in the Unchained queue. Victoria Frankenstein promises to create a "better" monster, which heavily implies the original line of Monsters did exist -- the ones we encounter now, in the present, are basically the "next generation" of them (Dracula is still Dracula, but his look has evolved). So, all that said, Pretorius appearing like he does in Bride of Frankenstein makes some sense within the internal logic of the area.

I don't love that!

I was a vocal dissident in the discussion around the apparent "This land is just inspired by the movies, not based on them" story for the area, but I could at least respect it as a creative take on how to bring the characters into the modern era.

This reads like...

Spoiler

... Universal wanting to have their cake and eat it, too. But what it actually says to me is, "The versions of the characters you really want to see did exist in this world... but we're not giving them to you."

And also... there's no doing "better" than Karloff. Positioning Karloff's Monster as inferior and nuMonster as the improved model rubs me the wrong way a bit.

But I'm glad I found this out now instead of when I'm about to ride it for the first time, because it might have really colored my experience in a not-positive way.

 

[Clive]

I don't love that!

I was a vocal dissident in the discussion around the apparent "This land is just inspired by the movies, not based on them" story for the area, but I could at least respect it as a creative take on how to bring the characters into the modern era.

This reads like...

Spoiler

... Universal wanting to have their cake and eat it, too. But what it actually says to me is, "The versions of the characters you really want to see did exist in this world... but we're not giving them to you."

And also... there's no doing "better" than Karloff. Positioning Karloff's Monster as inferior and nuMonster as the improved model rubs me the wrong way a bit.

But I'm glad I found this out now instead of when I'm about to ride it for the first time, because it might have really colored my experience in a not-positive way.

Spoiler: Monsters Unchained spoilers

I mean, you are of course entitled to your preferences and opinion, but I do not see how you could've had the Karloff version of the character doing any of what the Frankenstein Monster purportedly does in an action-oriented ride. As for the new model being superior... part of the whole thing about Frankenstein stories is hubris on the part of the creator, so I think that's perfectly consistent with the mythology and spirit of the original film series.

 

[Brian G.]

I don't love that!

I was a vocal dissident in the discussion around the apparent "This land is just inspired by the movies, not based on them" story for the area, but I could at least respect it as a creative take on how to bring the characters into the modern era.

This reads like...

Spoiler

... Universal wanting to have their cake and eat it, too. But what it actually says to me is, "The versions of the characters you really want to see did exist in this world... but we're not giving them to you."

And also... there's no doing "better" than Karloff. Positioning Karloff's Monster as inferior and nuMonster as the improved model rubs me the wrong way a bit.

But I'm glad I found this out now instead of when I'm about to ride it for the first time, because it might have really colored my experience in a not-positive way.

Just enjoy it for what it is, first, then hyperanalyze after.

 

[GA-MBIT]

I honestly believe strongly in going into everything with lowered expectations, as to not be disappointed when this ride doesn't include a free back massage or anything; Monsters Unchained is my favorite ride in the park. I also think expecting the whole world out of it risks the experience. I did have an incredibly strong positive reaction to the ride myself for all that that should matter to anyone haha.

I don't love that!

I was a vocal dissident in the discussion around the apparent "This land is just inspired by the movies, not based on them" story for the area, but I could at least respect it as a creative take on how to bring the characters into the modern era.

This reads like...

Spoiler

... Universal wanting to have their cake and eat it, too. But what it actually says to me is, "The versions of the characters you really want to see did exist in this world... but we're not giving them to you."

And also... there's no doing "better" than Karloff. Positioning Karloff's Monster as inferior and nuMonster as the improved model rubs me the wrong way a bit.

But I'm glad I found this out now instead of when I'm about to ride it for the first time, because it might have really colored my experience in a not-positive way.

Spoiler

The ride is generally a little more "Superhero-y" than I think some might be into or wanting. I'd say the horror elements are all still there; it's sufficiently dark, grim, foreboding and with numerous scare moments; but the character actions lean more "action-packed" than "bone-chilling". I actually really like how they did it, and I think they bridge the gap incredibly well of making it like a "horror Spider-Man". If Scream lurching out at your SCOOP was taken more seriously, and also done in a much more impactful way. Your milage may vary of course and I have heard some middling opinions as well from some.

I agree with Clive that I believe the Frankenstein plot points are done well. Victoria is largely successful up to this point in her experiments, but I was under no real impression that she or her creations were any more sane or "improved". That is how she describes herself and her monster, and now we get to see her hubris be taken to it's extremes, and as Universal Rides often do, "things go wrong". I was willing to buy into it myself.

 

[Tereglith]

If the land is really taking inspiration from all the movies (and certainly the 40s "monster rally" entries seem like as big an inspiration as any of the originals), then the last time we saw Henry's original monster he looked like Glenn Strange, after a brief stint as Bela Lugosi and a turn as Lon Chaney Jr. when that sulfur pit burned all the charisma out of him.

Spoiler

I can see why any self-respecting mad scientist would want to start fresh with a clean slate after all that.

 

[belloq87]

Spoiler: Monsters Unchained spoilers

I mean, you are of course entitled to your preferences and opinion, but I do not see how you could've had the Karloff version of the character doing any of what the Frankenstein Monster purportedly does in an action-oriented ride. As for the new model being superior... part of the whole thing about Frankenstein stories is hubris on the part of the creator, so I think that's perfectly consistent with the mythology and spirit of the original film series.

Spoiler

I guess I would just say don’t allude to Karloff at all. It invites a comparison with the new version that does not favor the new version for me (in terms of its more "generic guy" features).

Would anyone have really batted an eye if the Monster looked like Karloff, regardless of the “action” quotient of the ride? On the list of things requiring suspension of disbelief in a theme park, that's probably very, very low!

Just enjoy it for what it is, first, then hyperanalyze after.

I honestly believe strongly in going into everything with lowered expectations, as to not be disappointed when this ride doesn't include a free back massage or anything; Monsters Unchained is my favorite ride in the park. I also think expecting the whole world out of it risks the experience. I did have an incredibly strong positive reaction to the ride myself for all that that should matter to anyone haha.

You just threw me (... and frightened me!) using the word “simulator,” as most other reports indicated it’s lacking traditional simulator moments. I subsequently infer you're mostly talking about using projection media as extensions/backgrounds of sets.

I hope!

Spoiler

The ride is generally a little more "Superhero-y" than I think some might be into or wanting. I'd say the horror elements are all still there; it's sufficiently dark, grim, foreboding and with numerous scare moments; but the character actions lean more "action-packed" than "bone-chilling". I actually really like how they did it, and I think they bridge the gap incredibly well of making it like a "horror Spider-Man". If Scream lurching out at your SCOOP was taken more seriously, and also done in a much more impactful way. Your milage may vary of course and I have heard some middling opinions as well from some.

Yeah, I've already been recalibrating my tonal expectations since "campy" started getting frequently used to describe the ride.

Not that I was ever expecting the second coming of Alien Encounter, of course.

 

[Rhian]

If you're someone who is an avid fan of the original monsters it may be better to adjust expectations to "inspired by" rather than a direct sequel of sorts or something directly pulled from older films. I don't believe the ride is a disservice to that legacy.

as to not be disappointed when this ride doesn't include a free back massage

Spoiler

Oh but it does! Did you forget? It's very short-lived however and only covers the lower half.

 

[GA-MBIT]

You just threw me (... and frightened me!) using the word “simulator,” as most other reports indicated it’s lacking traditional simulator moments. I subsequently infer you're mostly talking about using projection media as extensions/backgrounds of sets.

I hope!

Ah! Yes, I guess that was poor wording on my part. I think I'm just used to describing Kuka Arm tech as simulators, when that's not always necessarily the case.

On the blended scale of "pure simulator" to the more practical, classical dark ride approach, it definitely leans away from it's simulator components.

Spoiler

The majority of scenes resemble the practical scenes of Forbidden Journey and Spider-Man in a number of ways. Screen tech is supplemental, and even when it isn't, the OLED screen tech provides deep enough color and contrasts to fool the eye in ways I've not seen utilized before in a ride of this scale. I wouldn't worry personally.

 

[GAcoaster]

Burning Blade was interesting today— burning but not spinning

 

[GA-MBIT]

Burning Blade was interesting today— burning but not spinning

It wasn't spinning when I went either. As someone who hadn't kept up with aerial photos or anything like that, I had no clue if that was the intended finished product or not while I was there. Definitely less impactful of a Diagon Dragon moment when it isn't fully operational.

 

[darkridelover]

If you're someone who is an avid fan of the original monsters it may be better to adjust expectations to "inspired by" rather than a direct sequel of sorts or something directly pulled from older films. I don't believe the ride is a disservice to that legacy.

Spoiler

Oh but it does! Did you forget? It's very short-lived however and only covers the lower half.

To pull back the curtain and to provide context: My understanding is some the rights to certain monsters are controlled by several different entities that all needed to approve the project. Contracts were more messy back then and changed hands through different estates over the years. From what I’ve heard some of the rights to the specific characters and looks from the classics were difficult or prohibitively expensive to acquire. So working with that constraint Universal had to update some of the characters and make them distinct from the originals.

 

[Mad Dog]

To pull back the curtain and to provide context: My understanding is some the rights to certain monsters are controlled by several different entities that all needed to approve the project. Contracts were more messy back then and changed hands through different estates over the years. From what I’ve heard some of the rights to the specific characters and looks from the classics were difficult or prohibitively expensive to acquire. So working with that constraint Universal had to update some of the characters and make them distinct from the originals.

Good bottom line explanation. That would explain a lot of the story, and character, decisions.

 

[Disneyhead]

Burning Blade was interesting today— burning but not spinning

I saw it burning and spinning, but apparently, like everything else in the park, it was not working most of the day. I mean they even had to close the queue to the closed Potter ride, haha.

I think it was "fire alarm test day".

 

[saint.piss]

I mean they even had to close the queue to the closed Potter ride, haha.

Lmao yep. I was there when they reopened it though

 

[Disneyhead]

Lmao yep. I was there when they reopened it though

I just laughed when I walked up and they said the queue was closed. We had waited all day for Monster's to open and we just happened to be exiting Werewolf when they opened it. We jumped in line. It looked like we were actually gonna get to ride it. We made it most of the way through the queue and the emergency flashing lights with alarm came on. Not the usual "the ride is down" but full blown Fire Alarm. They evaced the entire building, gift shop and all.

That is when we went to Potter and the queue was closed.

I would imagine the same thing happened there.

Fire alarm evac procedures are part of the training process, so...Welcome to your free visit to stress test the park.

They actually have to have OCFR on site for the Fire Drill stuff so it makes sense they would do multiple drills in one day.

 

[Clive]

To pull back the curtain and to provide context: My understanding is some the rights to certain monsters are controlled by several different entities that all needed to approve the project. Contracts were more messy back then and changed hands through different estates over the years. From what I’ve heard some of the rights to the specific characters and looks from the classics were difficult or prohibitively expensive to acquire. So working with that constraint Universal had to update some of the characters and make them distinct from the originals.

I can provide some additional context here. The "problem" characters here are those played by Boris Karloff, Bela Lugosi, and Lon Chaney, Sr -- so the original iterations of Frankenstein's Monster, The Mummy (Imhotep), Dracula, and Phantom. Each of the family estates have some say in how the likelinesses of each respective actor is used, even when in monster makeup.

 

[Wesker69]

It also doesn't help the fact that Universal didn't copyright Phantom back in the day because that wasn't a major thing in the early film era... so the 1925 classic fell into public domain (hence why the terrible 1943 remake is always included in the line-up instead)

 

[Lucky Planet]

It also doesn't help the fact that Universal didn't copyright Phantom back in the day because that wasn't a major thing in the early film era... so the 1925 classic fell into public domain (hence why the terrible 1943 remake is always included in the line-up instead)

is that remake really that bad ?

 

[Wesker69]

is that remake really that bad ?

Yes & no. I was fortunate enough to see it on the big screen in 2022 (with CFTBL), which was amazing, but it's a flawed adaptation

The main selling point of the 1943 remake is they used the original 1925 opera house set in SS28. So getting to see that with the chandelier in technicolor is amazing. But the plot/character changes are terrible (I've seen most of the Phantom adaptations... and morbidly curious about the upcoming Disney one lol).

At least HHN & epic lean into the Lon Chaney version as best they can