Frozen Ever After

[ThemeParks4Life]

**on a sidenote, what film did Tangled go up against that makes it incomparable to Frozen?

The only thing comparable was Yogi Bear a few weeks later and that bombed.

 

[Shucker]

Aside from the Hunger Games, its generally a different group of people going to see those movies. Its apples and oranges. Frozen isnt competing with Hobbit, Anchorman or American Hustle. Those are all rated PG-13 or greater (even though Harry Potter was PG-13, it was still in play due to kids loving it). On the whole its not the same audience. I get that some people may go see it twice and tell all there friends and family how great it is. But to get to $600 million you have to have families going back time and time again to see the film. And because there was really no competition in the same market space, over a school holiday where parents are scrounging to find things to do, Frozen is raking in the extra ticket sales.

Disney knows exactly (by percentage) how much repeat business they got due to essentially no competition during a school break. They probably knew for awhile that it was going to produce so many points higher than what it would have traditionally done with like movies.

As for the waits for Anna and Elsa, we are talking about a brand new product combined with one of the busiest times of year. I would suspect that they would be pulling the same wait times as Tangled does once everything dies down.

No one is hating on Disney, get over that. I love Disney and even worked at Disney. I love pretty much all the Disney movies, including Frozen. But say that competition doesn't matter substantially is, and I am going to say it again unapologetic this time, very naive. I am not trying to diminish the movie, Frozen is a great movie that just happen to hit the jack pot with when it was released. If you think Disney just looks at the bottom line to make multiple million dollar investments and does not break the numbers down to determine all the factors of why a movie is a success, then I don't what else to say.

 

[TylerDurden]

^lol, nobody here has said lack of competition isnt an important factor in a films box office. Just that it doesnt matter in this case, because theres no evidence the film would have done *poorly* in a different situation. This conversation started with a poster saying Frozens success was due to lack of competition. The only retort has been that the film is still successful enough to warrant a potential attraction, and thats the point you seem to be conveniently glossing over. Whats naive is to talk as though youre an expert on something when you clearly only have a very basic understanding of one concept, then continuously arguing a point that no one has even contradicted.

Also, what movie did Tangled go against? That film didnt do quite as well but had similar competition...your argument would collapse on itself even if anyone was arguing with you because you dont know fully what youre talking about.

 

[natespf]

^lol, nobody here has said lack of competition isnt an important factor in a films box office. Just that it doesnt matter in this case, because theres no evidence the film would have done *poorly* in a different situation. This conversation started with a poster saying Frozens success was due to lack of competition. The only retort has been that the film is still successful enough to warrant a potential attraction, and thats the point you seem to be conveniently glossing over. Whats naive is to talk as though youre an expert on something when you clearly only have a very basic understanding of one concept, then continuously arguing a point that no one has even contradicted.

Also, what movie did Tangled go against? That film didnt do quite as well but had similar competition...your argument would collapse on itself even if anyone was arguing with you because you dont know fully what youre talking about.

We all know that too much competition can cause a good movie to bomb, but the reverse is not true, lack of competition would not make a horrible movie become a break away hit. Those are two extremes, so hopefully we can find some middle ground with this one. I would think seeing how a movie would do on it's own would be a better indicator, it would be great if we could compare every movie this way. As was said, for $50-$70 there are many other things a family can do for 1-2 hours. How many people are like "Oh I hated that movie last week, but our hands are tied, it's the only one and we must see it again" ound:

 

[Jymmymack]

What I don't get about this argument is that we're saying that the only reason it's getting repeat family business is because there is no competition. Sorry folks. There's no way that people are going back to see it over and over just because it's the only family film on the market. It just took the top spot again this weekend with $20 mil. I'm sure that families are going for repeat business, but I guarantee parents aren't going to take their kids to a movie 2-3 times if they don't enjoy it. Parents can tolerate a lot. Paying to see a sub-par movie over and over, they cannot. I've seen several Top 10 film lists this year with Frozen on it (Yahoo, Collider, EW to name a few). This is a genuine mega hit. And I'm sorry, but if DM can be worthy of a ride, then the Frozen can as well. It's got beautiful animation, rave reviews, and has great music. And it's made a lot of money.

 

[TylerDurden]

^^ & ^, exactly. This is the point that some seem to be missing.

 

[knokout1]

Nobody is saying the ONLY reason it did good is because of no competition. I'm pretty sure everyone agrees it is a great movie, and that is why it did so well and had repeat visitors. But you can't say the lack of competition didn't play a SMALL role in the success.

 

[Jymmymack]

Nobody is saying the ONLY reason it did good is because of no competition. I'm pretty sure everyone agrees it is a great movie, and that is why it did so well and had repeat visitors. But you can't say the lack of competition didn't play a SMALL role in the success.

Of course it did. So did marketing and great reviews and word of mouth. But what's the point of saying all that? Millions have seen it. Millions love it. Millions are spent on it.

 

[Shucker]

So I would ask for those that are debating this point, do you have children? If you don't, then Im not certain how you can guarantee that parents wont take there kids to a movie that the parents may not like. I know its anecdotal, but I have many friends that don't particular like animated movies, and love me because I am usually willing to take their kids along with my kids to see a movie twice. But if I wasn't around, they would gladly do it if they did NOT have other options. The key point here is options, which in the kids marketplace for December, there really wasn't any out at theaters.

It did very well again this weekend, but what was it competing against????

Paranomal Activity
The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug
Anchorman 2: The Legend Continues
American Hustle
The Wolf of Wall Street

Yep, I am sure there was lots of families lining up to take their kids (on the last weekend of the school break) to see one of those.

Lets say there was just one other kid related movie out this weekend that was decent, that 20M+ is cut by 40% or even just 30%. That is a huge difference in numbers. And that would be if there was just one other real option out there. If there 2 or even 3 other options that percentage is much higher.

And for the final time, I'm not saying that its not a good movie or would have done poorly with any competition. It is a very good movie and one that I happened to really like. But lets say a family is going to see 3-4 movies over the holidays. If there are 3-4 good movies for the kids out in theaters they are going to split the time up and not just go back to see the same movie again, no matter how wonderful it is. Would Frozen be a huge hit if it had competition, absolutely. But I would be willing to wager it does 15%-20% less total receipts if it had the same line up Tangled had to compete with. Which means it would still be a mega hit and in the 450-525M range. And I am only using Tangled here because Frozen will end up with about the same revenue as Tangled.

Do I think they should make a ride out, yes I do as a fan (even though I like Malestrom and would rather it be left alone). But from a business perspective, I would push for a Tangled ride before Frozen just based on the numbers.

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Gosh this sounds familiar:

http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/01/05/as-deep-freeze-hits-moviegoers-return-frozen-to-box-office-top-spot/?_r=0

 

[TylerDurden]

I do have kids...its just that going to the movies is not the only activity we do to have fun . If we have already seen a movie that the kids dont want to see again, we just dont go. Its a very simple concept, actually.

 

[Jymmymack]

Wait how is it that Frozen will end up with the same amount of revenue as Tangled when it's already made $40 million more worldwide? And it's still making money. I'm not flaming you, I'm just saying that when you make comments like that it doesn't help your argument. And if you're arguing that it would have the same revenue as Tangled if it had the same run, that's purely speculative. As is this whole convo.

I don't have kids and I've seen it twice. My relatives have kids and they've seen it twice. And they don't go to the movies a lot with the kids. So it works both ways.

 

[OrlandoParks]

So exciting...

 

[Jymmymack]

Another interesting tidbit. Frozen has only been released in 29 foreign countries. Tangled released in 62.

 

[Shucker]

So my contribution to this thread is over. Believe all you want that the Disney magic would have seen Frozen to over 600M now even if there were 10 other kids movies in the marketplace.

 

[natespf]

Boy that is simple, thank you for that parental nugget that I am sure will lead me to being a more productive parent! Do you also buckle them up when you drive them around in the car????? Cause I am still confused about that one and you seem to know everything.

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So my contribution to this thread is over. Believe all you want that the Disney magic would have seen Frozen to over 600M now even if there were 10 other kids movies in the marketplace.

Thanks for moving the goal posts.

 

[ThemeParks4Life]

I'm pretty sure parents are taking their kids to The Hobbit, it has a bajillion tie ins.

 

[Hatetofly]

This just in!! This conversation has taken a step in the wrong direction and points trying to be made are being taken out of context all around. Let's just all agree that Disney sucks and Frozen is making James Cameron jealous at the box office to appease all parties.

Sarcasm...

Let's just agree to disagree and talk about the actual rumor vs the financial success of this film. I personally think it's a terrible move by replacing stories within the highly themed World Showcase. It's pretty much the only part of the park that makes sense anymore. I mean why bother with World Showcase in terms of attractions when Future World looks like something from 1994... The best thing Disney could do for Epcot IMO is revive the future it's covets so much.

 

[Jymmymack]

This just in!! This conversation has taken a step in the wrong direction and points trying to be made are being taken out of context all around. Let's just all agree that Disney sucks and Frozen is making James Cameron jealous at the box office to appease all parties.

Sarcasm...

Let's just agree to disagree and talk about the actual rumor vs the financial success of this film. I personally think it's a terrible move by replacing stories within the highly themed World Showcase. It's pretty much the only part of the park that makes sense anymore. I mean why bother with World Showcase in terms of attractions when Future World looks like something from 1994... The best thing Disney could do for Epcot IMO is revive the future it's covets so much.

I love ya Hate, you know I do, but you created the monster in the first place

 

[Hatetofly]

Yeah I didn't mean too that's what sucks, I promise this was not my intention lol

 

[Jymmymack]

I'm not really a big proponent of replacing original content with new IP stuff in Epcot, however Maelstrom is a bore. Wish they'd re-do the whole thing but that's not going to happen. Frozen does have trolls in it. I'm rather so-so about it. Not a fan of the overall idea, ok with the IP. It's a wash for me.