The Icons and Lore Thread

[HHN Maddux]

So in the lore, the LT investigation in 2015 was to find out who broke Jack and the other Icons out, correct? At the end it was revealed to be Bloody Mary, and the investigation culminated the mansion where you would end up banishing her forever, effectively finishing her storyline (mainly because they can't use her)?

 

[shiekra38]

Thoughts on the Icons:

• Jack - The one that started it all, and this is largely biased since 2015 was my very first year, but my favorite Icon. Cool backstory, funny but still horrific character, and just a fun Icon! Yeah I know and understand people are starting to get tired of him, but hey, I still really like him. Gonna be bittersweet if it's true the Icons house this year will be a bit of a farewell to him and the other Icons for a long time.
  
  
• Chance - Hot take time! Loved her event and loved her as an Icon. One of my most fond memories of her year was on the last night (not Halloween, the extra night), I got to go through Lunatic's Playground multiple times completely alone, and it was a blast. The cast was having fun with me, and I got to stay in the last room to watch the whole scene of Chance and the inmate.
  
  
• Eddie - He has a simple backstory, and I love it. Hope to see him finally get his own event one of these years. Plus he's the host of RUN, so big bonus points there.
  
  
• The Caretaker - Genuinely unsettling, with a creepy backstory. I have a fond memory from 2015 where he gave me his operating blades and let me take a photo with him while holding them.
  
  
• The Director - Eh... Not the best backstory and not really the most interesting character. Although, All Nite Die-In at 25 is still the fastest I've ever ran when two Purgers chased me through the zone with their chainsaws high in the air.
  
  
• The Storyteller - Probably my least favorite. No backstory, and not that interesting. Cool tongue kill though.
  
  
• The Usher - I know people don't like him because they don't think his backstory is good or that he just isn't interesting, but imo it's the opposite. He was just a poor guy who loved movies and died in an accident, and now continues to have his love for movies in the afterlife and punish those who are rude and disrupt them.
  
  
• Terra Queen - Holy sh*t. Insane lore and her year sounded absolutely incredible with everything tied in. I'm grateful that they're at least giving her a scare zone and possibly a show, but man am I disappointed they're not going full Terra Cruentes 2 for this year.
  
  
• Fear - The concept of Fear and the Icons being nothing but his little puppets is such a great idea... but the execution was unfortunately poor. Here's to hoping he's improved upon in the Icon house and when he returns for HHN 40!
  
  
• Lady Luck - Just like Fear, really cool concept, but not the best execution.

Fear should've been present in the HHNXX house...I will die on that hill

I mean, it would've also been dope if he had his own show

But I feel he was a last minute ad

 

[Legacy]

Fear should've been present in the HHNXX house...I will die on that hill

I mean, it would've also been dope if he had his own show

But I feel he was a last minute ad

Not so much “last minute” as “not the original plan.”

 

[shiekra38]

Not so much “last minute” as “not the original plan.”

Cindy was supposed to be the icon that year if I'm remembering

Eh, I still am glad Fear is getting some presence in a house this year

 

[pumpkinbot343]

Favorite characters in HHN lore?

The Projectionist

View attachment 12809

They should have just used him instead of creating the Usher.

What’s wrong with Usher? At least Julian Browning has a more distinctive design as opposed to the Projectionist fellow.

What would you say are the top three icons in HHN history (and for sake of argument, the icons list includes a certain character screwed by bizarre copyright claims)?

 

[Legacy]

What’s wrong with Usher? At least Julian Browning has a more distinctive design as opposed to the Projectionist fellow.

What would you say are the top three icons in HHN history (and for sake of argument, the icons list includes a certain character screwed by bizarre copyright claims)?

Usher is a boring, cut-rate Director/Phantom of the Opera rip-off that lifts directly from Eddie’s “horror movie fan” backstory. Julian is the most tropic and unoriginal of all the icons, and that includes the Pennywise rip-off with Freddy Krueger’s personality.

 

[pumpkinbot343]

Usher is a boring, cut-rate Director/Phantom of the Opera rip-off that lifts directly from Eddie’s “horror movie fan” backstory. Julian is the most tropic and unoriginal of all the icons, and that includes the Pennywise rip-off with Freddy Krueger’s personality.

I’m not quite sure Julian counts as a Director rip-off. Yes movies are involved; but their roles were different- Paolo was “creating” films; while Browning was merely “presenting” them (It helps that none of the lineup for 2003 sans ANDI used IPs). Plus The Director is more of a mad visionary and hardcore sadist enthusiast; whereas Usher seems like a friendly chap and is pretty chill as long as people obey the rules of the Universal Palace Theater.

I’d also argue that Storyteller and Bloody Mary beats Usher in terms of “most” unoriginal icon in Orlando’s history (the latter was literally based on an urban legend whereas Storyteller was… a thing).

 

[Legacy]

I’m not quite sure Julian counts as a Director rip-off. Yes movies are involved; but their roles were different- Paolo was “creating” films; while Browning was merely “presenting” them (It helps that none of the lineup for 2003 sans ANDI used IPs). Plus The Director is more of a mad visionary and hardcore sadist enthusiast; whereas Usher seems like a friendly chap and is pretty chill as long as people obey the rules of the Universal Palace Theater.

I’d also argue that Storyteller and Bloody Mary beats Usher in terms of “most” unoriginal icon in Orlando’s history (the latter was literally based on an urban legend whereas Storyteller was… a thing).

Storyteller was the only female icon for six years and predated the “murderous old lady” trope that started populating movies in the late aughts. She’s weak, but that’s because she was a last minute Marketing creation. Julian has no such excuse.

And HHN’s Bloody Mary has the entire “Dr. Agana” backstory, which is the most original thing they’ve done for an icon.

 

[shiekra38]

Storyteller was the only female icon for six years and predated the “murderous old lady” trope that started populating movies in the late aughts. She’s weak, but that’s because she was a last minute Marketing creation. Julian has no such excuse.

And HHN’s Bloody Mary has the entire “Dr. Agana” backstory, which is the most original thing they’ve done for an icon.

Bloody Mary is the best icon...send tweet

Aaaand we'll probably never see her again

 

[Eckert]

How much do you wanna bet HHN Icons Captured will end with the Icons becoming...uncaptured?

 

[Legacy]

How much do you wanna bet HHN Icons Captured will end with the Icons becoming...uncaptured?

A lot.

 

[pumpkinbot343]

Lately I’ve feeled that Mary is a Caretaker knockoff herself- both are doctors that turned crazy and then turned into supernatural killer ghosts. Ironically Mary would made more sense being the icon for 2002 that year (and yes I know all bout the Cindy ordeal).

The Storyteller situation will always leave me with questions. I think the original concept for 2005 was going to be based on a general concept like “Darkness” or “Fate”; but they changed it into the Terra Cruentus thing. The Lord of the Rings was huge in the 2000s; why not just market that then?Why did 2005 need an icon when they could just have marketed the fantasy creatures/theme? Why even make an icon that has nothing to do with the theme? Why not make the Eelmouth character the icon? Eelmouth could speak and he was infinitely way cooler looking than either Storyteller or Terra Queen. Why did they keep bringing the Storyteller back in later years when I’m pretty sure she doesn’t have any fans?

 

[OrlandoGuy]

Lately I’ve feeled that Mary is a Caretaker knockoff herself- both are doctors that turned crazy and then turned into supernatural killer ghosts. Ironically Mary would made more sense being the icon for 2002 that year (and yes I know all bout the Cindy ordeal).

The Storyteller situation will always leave me with questions. I think the original concept for 2005 was going to be based on a general concept like “Darkness” or “Fate”; but they changed it into the Terra Cruentus thing. The Lord of the Rings was huge in the 2000s; why not just market that then?Why did 2005 need an icon when they could just have marketed the fantasy creatures/theme? Why even make an icon that has nothing to do with the theme? Why not make the Eelmouth character the icon? Eelmouth could speak and he was infinitely way cooler looking than either Storyteller or Terra Queen. Why did they keep bringing the Storyteller back in later years when I’m pretty sure she doesn’t have any fans?

Storyteller is a lot more accessible and easier to convey in promo material. The queen by herself wasn’t really inherently scary, and the backstory that made her cool was too lengthy to put on a billboard or TV spot. I also think as popular as fantasy is, it’s still very much a niche outside of well-known IP. And as popular as Lord of the Rings was, it wasn’t ever outright horror.

On the other hand…old lady, bloody glasses, creepy stories. Storyteller checks a lot of easy boxes.

 

[pumpkinbot343]

Storyteller is a lot more accessible and easier to convey in promo material. The queen by herself wasn’t really inherently scary, and the backstory that made her cool was too lengthy to put on a billboard or TV spot. I also think as popular as fantasy is, it’s still very much a niche outside of well-known IP. And as popular as Lord of the Rings was, it wasn’t ever outright horror.

On the other hand…old lady, bloody glasses, creepy stories. Storyteller checks a lot of easy boxes.

Was it though? There could have been a couple of characters like the Knucklegrunts (Cemetery Mines), the Ore Mongers (Tangleroot) and the weird Terra Ghouls in Toon Lagoon and Seuss Landing (North/South Hollow) marketed and the commercial could have just simplified the story as “Evil medieval scary dark world. Boo.” And like I said, there was a character in the Terra Throne called Eelmouth (played by Jack the Clown’s actor) that looked way cooler than either of the 2 icons that year; maybe they could have used them*.

That or just slap that creepy Terra Cruentus logo onto posters. Honestly I don’t think 2005 needed an icon; I think 2004 worked pretty well without one.
EDIT: *him

 

[pumpkinbot343]

Question for anyone who knows the behind the scenes at Uni; this bugs the hell out of me about the commercials : why do most of them have different actors playing the HHN Icons as opposed to in-park actors? Bryce Ward did not portray the Caretaker for the spots in 2002 and 2006. The actors who played Storyteller, Director, and Lady Luck in the TV ads were not the ones who acted for the “in house” promos at Universal Orlando itself. I remember a podcast featuring one of the people (Michael Roddy) who used to work at Uni where he confirmed he had a friend who played Bloody Mary for the video they shot that year (2008) and there was another one who played Mary for the commercial and photo shoot. Hell even the DESIGNS of Albert, Elsa and Agana for the commercials don’t actually match the designs in-park.

I would assumed this was just because of the location (I’m pretty sure most of them were shot at Hollywood); however the spots for 2006, 2007, and 2015 DID feature the original actor for Jack the Clown (James Keaton) as well as Erin as Chance in 2015 (not counting her appearance in 2016’s ad as I’m pretty sure that just shoehorned a shot of her there). So… what gives?

 

[pumpkinbot343]

For context to my previous post;
here’s the actors who played the Caretaker, Storyteller, Director, and Mary in the tv ads:

And here’s the ones who played them in the parks:

 

[JawsVictim]

Question for anyone who knows the behind the scenes at Uni; this bugs the hell out of me about the commercials : why do most of them have different actors playing the HHN Icons as opposed to in-park actors? Bryce Ward did not portray the Caretaker for the spots in 2002 and 2006. The actors who played Storyteller, Director, and Lady Luck in the TV ads were not the ones who acted for the “in house” promos at Universal Orlando itself. I remember a podcast featuring one of the people (Michael Roddy) who used to work at Uni where he confirmed he had a friend who played Bloody Mary for the video they shot that year (2008) and there was another one who played Mary for the commercial and photo shoot. Hell even the DESIGNS of Albert, Elsa and Agana for the commercials don’t actually match the designs in-park.

I would assumed this was just because of the location (I’m pretty sure most of them were shot at Hollywood); however the spots for 2006, 2007, and 2015 DID feature the original actor for Jack the Clown (James Keaton) as well as Erin as Chance in 2015 (not counting her appearance in 2016’s ad as I’m pretty sure that just shoehorned a shot of her there). So… what gives?

Just thought I’d mention that the lady who played Bloody Mary in the video at the entrance of the park that year did my scareactor orientation in 2017.

 

[shiekra38]

For context to my previous post;
here’s the actors who played the Caretaker, Storyteller, Director, and Mary in the tv ads:

And here’s the ones who played them in the parks:

It kills me how they can't use (or maybe they can and just choose not too) their best icon, Bloody Mary

 

[pumpkinbot343]

It kills me how they can't use (or maybe they can and just choose not too) their best icon, Bloody Mary

Me and @Legacy had a whole discussion over why they wouldn’t bring her back. Either it’s because Universal doesn’t like the idea of an urban legend being copyrighted (I myself don’t have a problem with it; it’s not like Bobbie Weiner’s copyrighting Day of the Dead), the poor attendance rate of 2008 (especially considering the success of Carnival of Carnage), or of a certain employee (Roddy) who did some… not so great stuff and that man was heavily involved with the Bloody Mary icon.

 

[shiekra38]

Me and @Legacy had a whole discussion over why they wouldn’t bring her back. Either it’s because Universal doesn’t like the idea of an urban legend being copyrighted (I myself don’t have a problem with it; it’s not like Bobbie Weiner’s copyrighting Day of the Dead), the poor attendance rate of 2008 (especially considering the success of Carnival of Carnage), or of a certain employee (Roddy) who did some… not so great stuff and that man was heavily involved with the Bloody Mary icon.

2008 was my all time a favorite years and I liked it better than 2007 in many ways

Although, it seems the seeds for modern day HHN were planted in 2007/09