Universal Great Britain

[EllieB]

I think they already have enough land to achieve that. I think people are forgetting just how big a parcel of land they already own, even without taking up the option they seem to have on more space. Adding even more to their land bank is a step too far, IMO, unnecessary for their long term resort ambitions.

That's very possible too, I'm not trying to argue that they do need to buy more land, just offering possible reasons why they might. I'm sure they've done their sums and they'll do whatever they think is necessary for their long-term ambitions for the site.

Having said that though I now really want to do Hunger Games archery so I hope someone makes that happen, haha.

 

[yepthatguy]

View attachment 26117Train on the left is to Bedford (via Luton Airport and Luton in about 40 minutes), train on the right is to Paris.

Admittedly, you can’t walk across - but still v close.

(Sign isn’t broken, I just caught it mid refresh)

I was looking at St Pancras on Google maps and dropped a street view pin on top of the station by accident, and it looks like Google has street viewed the inside complete with a “level” indicator to switch floors.

So it’s possible to “walk” using street view from the Escalators down to the Eurostar entrance. I bet that’s help some people planning trips to say the least.

This link may or may not work.

Street View · Google Maps

Explore a place in a more immersive way in Google Maps.

maps.app.goo.gl

 

[bedfordmassive]

I was looking at St Pancras on Google maps and dropped a street view pin on top of the station by accident, and it looks like Google has street viewed the inside complete with a “level” indicator to switch floors.

So it’s possible to “walk” using street view from the Escalators down to the Eurostar entrance. I bet that’s help some people planning trips to say the least.

This link may or may not work.

Street View · Google Maps

Explore a place in a more immersive way in Google Maps.

maps.app.goo.gl

The good news for our European visitors is the route takes them past Greggs. Steak Slices for all.

 

[marsguo]

What type of ride we thinking Lord of the Rings will see? Lots of different opportunities. You could do a Soarin'-style flight over the Shire, a rapids ride for the barrel scene in Hobbit, or heck have a KUKA arm ride like FJ and Unchained.

First time poster here on the site! My dream for the LOTR area would be one that takes from the Hogsmede/Hogwarts formula of having a food and retail area that leads to the main E-Ticket attraction. In this case, Hobbiton would be a fantastic entrance to the land, with a Rivendell structure at the back of the land for you to discover.

In Hobbiton: Aside from the Green Dragon Inn and some shops inset into the hills of Bag End, the ride system I've not seen mentioned - but that would be really appreciated in this park given the need for dark rides - would be a relatively simple POTC/Na'vi RJ style boat ride through the shire at night during Bilbo's birthday. Queue through Bilbo's house! And on the ride, give us a "cocktail party" re-rideable experience with lots of dialogue and gags around the tables of food and drink, songs being sung, Gandalf wrangling mischievous Hobbits, ending with a big fireworks display. All vibes. The ride could then spit you out in the transition path between Hobbiton and Rivendell, which leads you to a big reveal.

If, in story terms, the transition path is the start of your "journey across middle earth" you could have some Ringwraith action of some kind in the trees - either live actors or something even more themed-in.

And then in Rivendell, Universal can pull out their bread-and-butter E-Ticket as you say, a KUKA arm thing with a bit more thrill and peril to it. Queue past the broken sword and the circle of chairs, etc.

This would be a full package land though and it'd be interesting to see if there's enough room for it. I sort of doubt that Universal would be brave enough to do boat ride like that, though.

 

[Disneyhead]

Everyone thinks the "no clones from "ORLANDO!"" thing is to not squelch UK travel to Florida. But I think it may be actually be to try to get domestic OR/USH fans to actually travel to the UK.

The park is built for those in the UK that could never fathom a trip to Orlando, those that go to Orlando, but will also go here, and if they drop LotR, I will be going to the UK.

Probably even with no LotR. But I am getting old, I don't have many new theme park openings to see.

 

[Luke Hutchinson]

First time poster here on the site! My dream for the LOTR area would be one that takes from the Hogsmede/Hogwarts formula of having a food and retail area that leads to the main E-Ticket attraction. In this case, Hobbiton would be a fantastic entrance to the land, with a Rivendell structure at the back of the land for you to discover.

In Hobbiton: Aside from the Green Dragon Inn and some shops inset into the hills of Bag End, the ride system I've not seen mentioned - but that would be really appreciated in this park given the need for dark rides - would be a relatively simple POTC/Na'vi RJ style boat ride through the shire at night during Bilbo's birthday. Queue through Bilbo's house! And on the ride, give us a "cocktail party" re-rideable experience with lots of dialogue and gags around the tables of food and drink, songs being sung, Gandalf wrangling mischievous Hobbits, ending with a big fireworks display. All vibes. The ride could then spit you out in the transition path between Hobbiton and Rivendell, which leads you to a big reveal.

If, in story terms, the transition path is the start of your "journey across middle earth" you could have some Ringwraith action of some kind in the trees - either live actors or something even more themed-in.

And then in Rivendell, Universal can pull out their bread-and-butter E-Ticket as you say, a KUKA arm thing with a bit more thrill and peril to it. Queue past the broken sword and the circle of chairs, etc.

This would be a full package land though and it'd be interesting to see if there's enough room for it. I sort of doubt that Universal would be brave enough to do boat ride like that, though.

Your idea for a Hobbiton water ride is kind of perfect! Personally I’d like to see any secondary attraction use the Kuka Arm tech but I think that’s unlikely

 

[Altonsky]

Given how difficult it is to develop residential property and how much pressure Bedford Council is under to hit housing targets, than kind of land-banking where there is never the intention to use the space other than a green buffer should be, rightly IMO, frowned upon.

Don't they have sufficient space for that already? The plots that @tommyhawkins has drawn already show there's space for that kind of resort. I'm not sure that comparisons with land use at Universal Orlando are very helpful as I can't imagine USGB ever being on that scale, in the same way as DLP will never be the same scale as WDW.

I don’t see why it should be frowned upon when let’s face it if houses were built on the land around this site they’d be snapped up by property developers as air bnbs which entirely defeats the point of building them in the first place.

No houses should be built around this area. It should all be used for entertainment purposes whether that’s universal or not and the council would be stupid to approve anything that’s not within that remit.

 

[rob@rar]

No houses should be built around this area. It should all be used for entertainment purposes whether that’s universal or not and the council would be stupid to approve anything that’s not within that remit.

How big should that area be? That’s what I’m pondering. I think USGB is always going to be a short-break destination, so how much land does Universal need beyond what they have already bought / have an option on to create a fully featured destination that most families will visit for no more than two or three nights? There is a large parcel of land due south of the Universal plot running towards the college, which has been bought for housing development. Should Universal have bought that land? As suggested, there’s adjacent plots of land currently used for commercial warehousing, should Universal buy that land? The concrete works and the car auction site. The lakes adjacent to Universal’s northern parcel of land. There’s no shortage of options very close to what Universal already own, which as we can see is already a huge plot of land similar in size to Universal Orlando’s main campus. So I’m just trying to get a feel for how much land is necessary for Universal’s likely long term plans in Bedford. Simply hoovering up land at commercial rates to buy a large chunk of Bedfordshire and not have a sustainable use for it seems like bad business sense to me.

 

[Altonsky]

How big should that area be? That’s what I’m pondering. I think USGB is always going to be a short-break destination, so how much land does Universal need beyond what they have already bought / have an option on to create a fully featured destination that most families will visit for no more than two or three nights? There is a large parcel of land due south of the Universal plot running towards the college, which has been bought for housing development. Should Universal have bought that land? As suggested, there’s adjacent plots of land currently used for commercial warehousing, should Universal buy that land? The concrete works and the car auction site. The lakes adjacent to Universal’s northern parcel of land. There’s no shortage of options very close to what Universal already own, which as we can see is already a huge plot of land similar in size to Universal Orlando’s main campus. So I’m just trying to get a feel for how much land is necessary for Universal’s likely long term plans in Bedford. Simply hoovering up land at commercial rates to buy a large chunk of Bedfordshire and not have a sustainable use for it seems like bad business sense to me.

Even if Universal don’t buy any additional land I don’t think the fields around it should be housing when the housing would no doubt be used as short term lets. It defeats the whole point of building it, then you also have issues with neighbours potentially complaining.

All of the land around Universals if not purchased by themselves should be zoned for hotels, hospitality, entertainment etc.

Chances are at some point further down the line those warehouses will be pulled down, the land they sit on is about to go up in value massively and it’s a waste of space having something as mundane as warehouses on them. Whoever owns the land will sell it off at some point, not necessarily to Universal but to someone.

Personally I agree with what a few of the others have said, purchasing a couple of extra parcels of land to effectively square out their land would be ideal imo.

But either way no warehouses and certainly no houses should be built on any of that land.

It’s a prime piece of land for an arena tbh with the train links and universal now opening up shop, things like that should be in the pipeline imo.

 

[rob@rar]

I don’t see nearby housing being used solely for short term lets, not least because for a large fraction of the year there would be relatively few bookings to go around. Plenty of people looking to book during school holidays and the warm months of the year, but park attendance will be dramatically lower in the off-season. I can’t see property developers paying huge sums to buy up all the nearby newly constructed houses to offer short-term bookings and all the logistical challenges that go with in when for a chunk of the year that expensive asset will generate no income. Private homeowners occasionally AirBnB’ing spare rooms or house extensions for sure, but huge swathes of residential housing isn’t going to be bought purely for holiday rentals, it just makes no economic sense. It doesn’t happen near DLP, it doesn’t happen in Kissimmee, it doesn’t happen in Anaheim or Studio City areas in LA, and it won’t happen in Bedford.

For the land round the Universal development which is available I guess it will be sold on the open market. If Premier Inn want to build a large hotel because they think there’s a great opportunity they might well have to compete for that land with a company who want to build a warehouse because it has great transport links, or a data centre and software engineering hub as part of the Oxford-Cambridge corridor, or a property developer looking to make a good return on residential developments. Bedford Council will have a number of different priorities to address, including wide ranging economic development and significant government pressure to build more residential housing. That will be reflected in how they zone land in their authority and the kinds of planning permission they grant. The land alongside the A421 corridor south of Bedford is a valuable resource and could be used in a range of ways, and I’m sure the Council is aware of that. Just take a look at their draft Local Plan 2040 to see the competing pressures they are juggling.

 

[tommyhawkins]

Everyone thinks the "no clones from "ORLANDO!"" thing is to not squelch UK travel to Florida. But I think it may be actually be to try to get domestic OR/USH fans to actually travel to the UK.

The park is built for those in the UK that could never fathom a trip to Orlando, those that go to Orlando, but will also go here, and if they drop LotR, I will be going to the UK.

Probably even with no LotR. But I am getting old, I don't have many new theme park openings to see.

I think you are 100% correct. You would be very welcome. People want to visit London anyway, what not sweeten the pot with something familiar but new from home. Also think with Stansted airport expansion happening there is a strong chance a long haul airline will build a Transatlantic base there and it's very easy to get a train to Bedford via Cambridge via EWR line.

Another point that no one is making that seems very obvious to me is that the studio tours will probably start building rides, and expanding the Tour out with so many more visitors so close by. Which would mirror how USH started out, I still think people holding on to the notion potter in this park eventually are being unrealistic

 

[EllieB]

When the Studio Tour first opened, the intention was that it would showcase HP stuff for a few years until interest waned, then pivot to showcasing costumes, sets and props from whatever the next popular franchise they had was. That's why it's officially called the Warner Brothers Studio Tour: The Making of Harry Potter, not The Harry Potter Studio Tour, despite what people might refer to it as. The fact that they never pivoted away and instead chose to create new areas, themed food spaces, and expand their footprint goes to show I think that they've decided HP is there for the long term, not the short term.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if their next expansion included a dark ride. They already have green screen photo experiences, immersive events (like after hours dining in the great hall) and pseudo-ride experiences (like on the train). I don't know how much space they have to work with on the site, but adding a theatre show or a ride experience of some kind seems the logical next move for them.

 

[rob@rar]

The fact that they never pivoted away and instead chose to create new areas, themed food spaces, and expand their footprint goes to show I think that they've decided HP is there for the long term, not the short term.

They decided that because it’s wildly popular. You have to book your entry time weeks, sometimes months in advance otherwise you won’t get in. Just like the Wizarding World lands in all the Universal parks are wildly popular, where for many it will be their rope-drop destination and the land where they spend the most money on food and souvenirs. It continues to be a juggernaut IP which I’d love to see in USGB but accept that almost certainly isn’t going to happen. For me the biggest question we have is what other juggernaut IP Universal is going to place in their Bedford park, as I’m pretty sure it won’t be Shrek Land.

 

[EllieB]

They decided that because it’s wildly popular. You have to book your entry time weeks, sometimes months in advance otherwise you won’t get in. Just like the Wizarding World lands in all the Universal parks are wildly popular, where for many it will be their rope-drop destination and the land where they spend the most money on food and souvenirs. It continues to be a juggernaut IP which I’d love to see in USGB but accept that almost certainly isn’t going to happen.

Yes absolutely; my point was that it has turned out to be a lot more popular than they anticipated, so they're likely to continue to look for new ways to capitalise on that popularity.

 

[rob@rar]

Yes absolutely; my point was that it has turned out to be a lot more popular than they anticipated, so they're likely to continue to look for new ways to capitalise on that popularity.

Indeed. They have been regularly extending the tour since it opened and I’m sure that will continue so they can increase the daily headcount. Haven’t there been rumours for at least a few months of a ride of some kind being added to the tour? I vaguely recall reading something along those lines.

 

[rob@rar]

Just a quick heads-up that Bedford Council’s Executive Committee will meet at 6.30pm this evening. This is the committee that will prepare the Council’s response to whatever consultation the government runs on Universal’s formal planning application. The Universal proposal isn’t on the Executive Committee’s agenda this evening, but this is the first time the Committee has met since the government’s annoucement that the park is going ahead, so perhaps it will be mentioned in the margins. If anyone is keen to follow the meeting’s progress you can see the agenda papers and watch a live stream of it from this webpage.

 

[tommyhawkins]

Buying that parcel of land would make sense to me as it would provide loads of expansion area for theme park or hotel space. I'm sure the train line running between that and Universal's main parcel of land wouldn't provide an insurmountable barrier.

I'm pretty sure that parcel of land, known as CP Farm (the northern part of the plot) and Randall's Farm (the southern part, where the A421 spur road is likely to be constructed) is owned by O&H Ltd. If they are looking to sell to Universal (or have already agreed an option) that might be the mysterious plot of land that Universal refer to. CP Farm is 48 hectares (119 acres), so with the additional land at Randall's Farm it's certainly in the ball park to take Universal's land purchase up to 700 acres, or so. The one possible fly in the ointment is that O&H have been promoting that site to Bedford Council as residential housing development, as a part of the council's 2040 development plan.

I've always been a bit confused about the land where the A421 slip road will be located. That road link is absolutely key to Universal's transport plans, so I've never understood why they don't already own it. They did lots of archeological survey work last year, so clearly it is in the frame for change of use from the current agricultural fields, but aren't Universal taking a risk that someone else identifies a use for that land which would kibosh Universal's plan for road traffic entering the theme park...?

This was the original plan when Cloud Wing was planning this project.

Depending on what type of planning permission they get (and again part of the reason ive been saying ad nauseum they should/would go for an NSIP is because this is national infrastructure and you need to plan decades ahead, and dont want a Disneyland situation) they should have powers for compulsory purchase/eminent domain to block anyone else buying the land. It's easier for Uni to buy those 150 acres now and just sit on it til at least 2036 than be boxed in by other things.

I also believe I have a reason why in the original consultation plans there was a red hatched area, ill talk about that more another time though

 

[yepthatguy]

View attachment 26129
This was the original plan when Cloud Wing was planning this project.

Depending on what type of planning permission they get (and again part of the reason ive been saying ad nauseum they should/would go for an NSIP is because this is national infrastructure and you need to plan decades ahead, and dont want a Disneyland situation) they should have powers for compulsory purchase/eminent domain to block anyone else buying the land. It's easier for Uni to buy those 150 acres now and just sit on it til at least 2036 than be boxed in by other things.

I also believe I have a reason why in the original consultation plans there was a red hatched area, ill talk about that more another time though

That’s a lot of dark rides!

 

[rob@rar]

... part of the reason ive been saying ad nauseum they should/would go for an NSIP is because this is national infrastructure and you need to plan decades ahead,

I don't think the Universal project would be covered by the legal definition of a national infrastructure project. The relevant Secretary of State could direct the National Planning Inspectorate to treat Universal's planning application as a national infrastructure project, but that would be under Ministerial direction rather than covered by the relevant legislation.

I hope that Universal's planning application isn't taken through the NSIP process as it's a slow, cumbersome process which can easily take 18 months from the point it is first referred to the Inspectorate. If that happens it's going to screw Universal's timetable and we could very easily see a delay to the start of ground work in early 2026, and subsequent knock-on to the opening date.

 

[rob@rar]

I also believe I have a reason why in the original consultation plans there was a red hatched area, ill talk about that more another time though

Looking forward to that, as the hatched area and why it appeared that Universal hadn't bought that plot of land has always puzzled me.