Thor: Love and Thunder

[Lucky Planet]

Spoiler

Yup, the only reason that we spent all that time at Omnipotence City is because Valkyrie needed a weapon and they somehow settled on Zeus. As you said, his weapon was no more impactful to the story than if Valkyrie had picked up a sword in New Asgard and we skipped the 20 minutes or so of Omnipotence City altogether.

i Did laugh, i laughed at the entire movie, but

Spoiler

the Zeus scene feels like "deleted scenes" or outtakes, feels like improv scenes that get cut where the actors are goofing off... but as much as i love Starlord, the guardians scenes were also like deleted scene outtakes, Thor has some conversations with them, but, why werent the guardians included in the final fight, or called at the end? imagine if they joined the kids, or if they helped somehow.
i almost felt like the movie was setting up for them to join at the end.

very weird. they definitely had great jokes for me, but missed opportunities

 

[Nick]

I'm not going to sit here and pretend the movie didn't have it's funny moments, I just thought some of them either didn't work for me or the gags happened a few too many times.

 

[CoryLevy91]

Eh, I felt the emotional moments carried their weight just fine. I teared up during the hospital discussion with Thor and Jane and I teared up even harder when Jane shows up in the final battle to help Thor. I love the stuff with Gorr and I think it was handled fantastically, his plot is one of the most memorable of the MCU for me and despite appearing in only one film he's one of my favorite characters now.

I just think you're looking for something you were never going to find if you were hoping for an MCU movie to slow down to a crawl and have extended scenes of heartbreak and drama. That's not what these movies are really about.

You can have whatever opinion of a movie you want, obviously, just disagree that the humor undercut the emotional weight big time in Love & Thunder. To me this was one of the best executions of the Marvel style of fun mixed with heart and tragedy.

 

[Nick]

Eh, I felt the emotional moments carried their weight just fine. I teared up during the hospital discussion with Thor and Jane and I teared up even harder when Jane shows up in the final battle to help Thor. I love the stuff with Gorr and I think it was handled fantastically, his plot is one of the most memorable of the MCU for me and despite appearing in only one film he's one of my favorite characters now.

I just think you're looking for something you were never going to find if you were hoping for an MCU movie to slow down to a crawl and have extended scenes of heartbreak and drama. That's not what these movies are really about.

You can have whatever opinion of a movie you want, obviously, just disagree that the humor undercut the emotional weight big time in Love & Thunder. To me this was one of the best executions of the Marvel style of fun mixed with heart and tragedy.

But see we're 29 movies in and I am generally an optimistic person and look for the positive. I'm an MCU apologist in many ways as long as I have a good time with a film or show (just because I prefer many of Marvel's characters). It's been a long ass time since I came out of an MCU project and felt so utterly underwhelmed with a film. I know what to expect from an MCU movie and I don't think i'm asking too much to want to feel the motion a bit more (not to see, feel). Taika literally accomplished this with Ragnarok already.

Sure the stuff with Jane was literally some of the best stuff in the whole movie aside from Gorr (which in my initial review was why I said I loved her in this movie and I think Hemsworth got outshined by not only Bale, but Portman). However, I couldn't muster upto get too emotional about Jane's condition because we hadn't seen her since The Dark World and it was obvious what she was going to choose to do. Some simple things like adding a few more scenes with her for us to fall in love with her more and then bring in Darcy in the hospital towards the end for one last scene with them.

I'm really not asking for a lot out of the movie and i'm not asking for Thor: The Dark World where it's all serious, no humor, etc. I just wanted better balance. Bring turn down the dial on the jokes and bring up the emotional energy in certain parts and the film would've been a lot better. I think that's why i'm so down on it is because I dislike the over-use of comedy and the disservice to more serious moments that even for an MCU film I walked out thinking "what the hell did I just watch?"

 

[CoryLevy91]

It's just a difference of opinion, I thoroughly enjoyed Love & Thunder and thought it nailed the tones and emotion and balanced everything perfectly. Especially since everything about this film was marketed as just a fun romp with a scary looking villain. It's such a great twist right off the bat that the biggest story plots here are a villain born out of tragedy, Jane fighting cancer and Thor himself not knowing what the hell he is in the grand scheme of things.

To each his own, I don't love (or even actually see) every MCU offering but this one was a home run for me and I credit most of that to the stellar cast and Taika Waititi.

 

[Nick]

It's just a difference of opinion, I thoroughly enjoyed Love & Thunder and thought it nailed the tones and emotion and balanced everything perfectly. Especially since everything about this film was marketed as just a fun romp with a scary looking villain. It's such a great twist right off the bat that the biggest story plots here are a villain born out of tragedy, Jane fighting cancer and Thor himself not knowing what the hell he is in the grand scheme of things.

To each his own, I don't love (or even actually see) every MCU offering but this one was a home run for me and I credit most of that to the stellar cast and Taika Waititi.

Yeah, as I said, i'm not going to pretend it didn't have it's funny moments or it's solid emotional moments. I just didn't like the mix of it all and a lot of the jokes didn't land or got old after coming back around for the fifth or sixth time. I'll probably rewatch it and like it fine enough, i'm just pointing out the negative because imo, the stuff that didn't work for me in this movie REALLY didn't work. However, I can totally see how people can enjoy this film perfectly fine too.

I think to sum up how i'm feeling is basically this - If this was a straight to streaming movie, I would've been completely satisfied like with Hemsworth's recent Netflix film, Spiderhead. Had I planned to take time out of my day, spend money on tickets and go to a theater to see Spiderhead, I probably have different feelings on that movie, though.

 

[SailwiththeTide]

Haven’t seen it and wont till it is streaming. Just not something I want to go see but MCU fanboys AND VFX atrists are mad at Taika for him dissing his own movie. He knows its crap and doesn’t care. Chapek’s check cashed.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Spoiler

Yup, the only reason that we spent all that time at Omnipotence City is because Valkyrie needed a weapon and they somehow settled on Zeus. As you said, his weapon was no more impactful to the story than if Valkyrie had picked up a sword in New Asgard and we skipped the 20 minutes or so of Omnipotence City altogether.

Spoiler: Next Thor Movie

They went to the city for more then one weapon

1) It was to show most gods, will sit around and not do anything
2) To set up Zeus and Hercules as villains
3) Thunderbolt seems like the older weapon of the gods...which is why many thing Thor could give the power to all the kids only because he had the oldest and maybe most popwerful weapons of the gods

Even if 3 is not correct 1/2 are for sure why they showed the city

 

[Nick]

Spoiler: Next Thor Movie

They went to the city for more then one weapon

1) It was to show most gods, will sit around and not do anything
2) To set up Zeus and Hercules as villains
3) Thunderbolt seems like the older weapon of the gods...which is why many thing Thor could give the power to all the kids only because he had the oldest and maybe most popwerful weapons of the gods

Even if 3 is not correct 1/2 are for sure why they showed the city

Spoiler

They didn't need to show Zeus or Hercules at all in this movie. They were clearly setting up a future Thor storyline with the post-credits, but they could've just had that post credits scene introducing the two of them and you could cut out that entire segment.

Now given that there was so many Gods all in one place at Omnipotence City, if you were going to use time out of this movie to bring that location into the movie, they could've made it so much cooler than feeling like a side quest.

This movie's villain was Gorr the GOD BUTCHER, correct? This would've been a great place to bring him in and, you know, actually do some God Butchering. We didn't see Gorr do any of that in the movie. It also would've really established him as a fearful villain. Christian Bale did a great job with what he was given and was a standout, but in the Shadow realm with it being black and white, you could hardly see the monsters that they had to fight because it was so dark. I just don't think the fight sequences were all that compelling and something here could've filled what felt like wasted time.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Spoiler

They didn't need to show Zeus or Hercules in this movie at all in this movie. They were clearly setting up a future Thor storyline with the post-credits, but they could've just had that post credits scene introducing the two of them and you could cut out that entire segment.

Now given that there was so many Gods all in one place at Omnipotence City, if you were going to use time out of this movie to bring that location into the movie, they could've made it so much cooler than feeling like a side quest.

This movie's villain was Gorr the GOD BUTCHER, correct? This would've been a great place to bring him in and, yeah know, actually do some God Butchering. We didn't see Gorr do any of that in the movie. It also would've really established him as a fearful villain. Christian Bale did a great job with what he was given and was a standout, but in the Shadow realm with it being black and white, you could hardly see the monsters that they had to fight because it was so dark. I just don't think the fight sequences were all that compelling and something here could've filled what felt like wasted time.

Spoiler: Thor

I dont disagree we could have seen Gorr kill more....but I think the point of Zeus was to make us all hate him or dislike him and set him up but if they didnt go to all the other gods then people would complain...but why didn't they go ask more gods for help?

I just think it's werid Moon Knight or his god didnt show up...because they seemed not to mind helping other gods kill people

 

[youhow2]

Spoiler

They didn't need to show Zeus or Hercules at all in this movie. They were clearly setting up a future Thor storyline with the post-credits, but they could've just had that post credits scene introducing the two of them and you could cut out that entire segment.

Now given that there was so many Gods all in one place at Omnipotence City, if you were going to use time out of this movie to bring that location into the movie, they could've made it so much cooler than feeling like a side quest.

This movie's villain was Gorr the GOD BUTCHER, correct? This would've been a great place to bring him in and, you know, actually do some God Butchering. We didn't see Gorr do any of that in the movie. It also would've really established him as a fearful villain. Christian Bale did a great job with what he was given and was a standout, but in the Shadow realm with it being black and white, you could hardly see the monsters that they had to fight because it was so dark. I just don't think the fight sequences were all that compelling and something here could've filled what felt like wasted time.

Spoiler

Eh, sure it could've been more "cool" but that's not really something you can debate the merits of... I have to argue that it was indeed a part needed in the film.


They initially went to the city to rally the gods to defeat Gorr. There was nothing in it for the other Gods, and they tried to keep Thor & party there as prisoners to prevent all of them from dying, rather than risk life and limb in a conflict that did not directly concern them. Who else, other than the God of all Gods to be the one who stands in Thor's way?

This is clever because it shows how smart Gorr was in kidnapping the children to make Thor, who possessed the key he needed to complete his goal come to him. He was able to manipulate and create conflict between the good and neutral forces, turning them against each other and effectively sets up more conflict later down the line... Thor basically stepped above his level and attempted to kill the main God. Now, Thor is hunted by non other than Hercules... Who in the comics is manipulated by Kang. And every piece of this plot is earned and has effective logic to it.

The thing is, you're not supposed to feel sympathetic towards the Gods. Did you really feel bad about the guy in the first scene? Gorr doesn't really earn his "evil card" until he kidnaps the children, it's there where he crosses the line and becomes irredeemable, earns his death. After the first scene, you're kind of rooting for him, until it comes down to our God(s), Thor...

Having him kill more Gods on screen would be a waste because you're supposed to be at least understanding to his cause, it's what makes him a tragic character... Can't really blame him for picking up the necrosword, but taking it any further than kidnapping children (which is taking it to the extreme, kidnapping a whole generation of asgardians...) Who of significance was he supposed to kill? His arc was perfect.

Going to omnipotence city was actually a brilliant way to introduce Zeus and Hercules, advance the story and foreshadow conflict and possibly the death of our Thor. [\spoiler]


I think the thing most people are complaining about is tone. This guy is REALLY good at having misjointed, disconnected tones and beats somehow fit together and create great film. It's like visual industrial music with a marvel wrapper. I loved it. Not my favorite marvel movie, but pleasantly surprised by how much I enjoyed it. The only thing I can critique it on is really too many jokes. It was only just a tad bit too much, but overkill is also a style.

7.5/10

 

[Brian G.]

Haven’t seen it and wont till it is streaming. Just not something I want to go see but MCU fanboys AND VFX atrists are mad at Taika for him dissing his own movie. He knows its crap and doesn’t care. Chapek’s check cashed.

While there is some blame for Taika as the director, this isn't just a Thor 4 issue. The CGI for Marvel lately has been a joke.

 

[Lucky Planet]

Eh, I felt the emotional moments carried their weight just fine. I teared up during the hospital discussion with Thor and Jane and I teared up even harder when Jane shows up in the final battle to help Thor. I love the stuff with Gorr and I think it was handled fantastically, his plot is one of the most memorable of the MCU for me and despite appearing in only one film he's one of my favorite characters now.

I just think you're looking for something you were never going to find if you were hoping for an MCU movie to slow down to a crawl and have extended scenes of heartbreak and drama. That's not what these movies are really about.

You can have whatever opinion of a movie you want, obviously, just disagree that the humor undercut the emotional weight big time in Love & Thunder. To me this was one of the best executions of the Marvel style of fun mixed with heart and tragedy.

is not about needing extended scenes of heartbreak and drama. but technically even the movie itself downplays the Jane situation. i dont need 3 hours of drama but this movie expects to be a ridiculous funny comedy and at the same time, in small tiny moments, deal with the darkness of Jane's situation and the darkness of the villain.
they wanna be seinfeld and a dark soap opera
it is disjointed, you are watching 2 opposite movies at once.

 

[rageofthegods]

Kinda think it's time to dial it back on comedy Thor and bring back some of the gravitas. Waititi's decision to turn Thor into a parody of himself in Ragnarok was an appropriate shot of life to the character but now the surprise of Hemsworth being a good comedic actor is gone and I'm not really sure if he can carry a movie as this sort of star (this is not an insult to him to be clear, it just doesn't feel like what he's built for or what he was brought in to do).

 

[Nick]

I'm fine with Taika directing a Thor 5.... IF we bring back the Ragnarok writing team.

Most people don't know this, but the writing team for Ragnarok consisted of Eric Pearson, Craig Kyle, and Christopher Yost. Taika was not a writer on that film. I didn't even realize this until recently. He can direct just fine, but it seems as if Marvel let him go basically unchecked in this movie to it's detriment. The writing was pretty much the entire problem with this movie, so that falls on Taika's script rather than any big directorial problems.

While there is some blame for Taika as the director, this isn't just a Thor 4 issue. The CGI for Marvel lately has been a joke.

I'm not exactly sure what the problem is or how many people they have hired to do SFX, but I feel like it needs to be more. With the complaints from SFX artists about being overworked and there being so many projects now, I can see why quality has taken a dip if they aren't paying the extra money to hire more people.

 

[CoryLevy91]

is not about needing extended scenes of heartbreak and drama. but technically even the movie itself downplays the Jane situation. i dont need 3 hours of drama but this movie expects to be a ridiculous funny comedy and at the same time, in small tiny moments, deal with the darkness of Jane's situation and the darkness of the villain.
they wanna be seinfeld and a dark soap opera
it is disjointed, you are watching 2 opposite movies at once.

And I disagree. You can have multiple emotional wavelengths in one film, it just has to be executed well and I feel Love & Thunder did that. Again, personal opinions.

 

[belloq87]

Kinda think it's time to dial it back on comedy Thor and bring back some of the gravitas. Waititi's decision to turn Thor into a parody of himself in Ragnarok was an appropriate shot of life to the character but now the surprise of Hemsworth being a good comedic actor is gone and I'm not really sure if he can carry a movie as this sort of star (this is not an insult to him to be clear, it just doesn't feel like what he's built for or what he was brought in to do).

I agree with your general sentiment, though I do also think that RAGNAROK balanced turning Thor into a funnier character without completely removing the gravitas in the way that has happened since ENDGAME and now in LOVE AND THUNDER. His arc in that movie -- and then into INFINITY WAR -- is pretty solid.

 

[Bort]

It was a very odd movie. Fun pieces, but as a sum of all parts...not great.

The part that made me chuckle the most was the "Infinity Conez" ice cream shop in New Asgard. Straight out of a "Real of Fake" OU segment.

 

[rageofthegods]

It was a very odd movie. Fun pieces, but as a sum of all parts...not great.

The part that made me chuckle the most was the "Infinity Conez" ice cream shop in New Asgard. Straight out of a "Real of Fake" OU segment.

The joke is fun, but like, that's odd in universe right? Like wasn't the snap a big tragedy that people still have major trauma over? Why would it be the basis of an ice cream shop?

Whatever, best not to think about it.

 

[Nick]

The joke is fun, but like, that's odd in universe right? Like wasn't the snap a big tragedy that people still have major trauma over? Why would it be the basis of an ice cream shop?

Whatever, best not to think about it.

You could think about it as the community taking pride in defeating Thanos I guess?