Halloween Horror Nights 22 Discussion

[maxairmike]

I can't believe the amount of people buying express passes this year. I think this contributes to the problem as well. I see more people going into express than I do the actual line.

This, this, this! It feels like they are overselling Express for an event with only...9 unique attractions, and 8 of them have Express (does 20 Penny have Express as well?). Sure, Express can be used on the rides, but people aren't getting Express for the rides, and that's being reflected in the lines I've seen for the rides so far on the nights I've gone. They either need to reduce the amount of Express they're selling, or find a way to entice/force Express users to the rides instead of just the houses.

 

[Scarletwebslingr]

They're adding more characters to streets.

 

[TheDecemberists]

Their business plan is built on having Annual Passes and like services available to residents. If they didn't have these it would be a PR fiasco and despite everyone saying "I won't attend next year", people legitimately wouldn't attend. I could understand them having to scale it back some, but I can't find any justifiable reason for them to not offer multi-day ticket incentives.

Frequent Fear Pass is fine. But Frequent Fear Pass with express? That is ridiculous.

 

[Eric]

I don't understand why they limit the express to just houses. It makes no sense. It would alleviate house lines a little if they allowed express for rides.

And yea, they are definitely overselling express. I guarantee they have a limit set, but oversell that amount most nights. It's insane and not really fair to the every day guest.

20 penny doesn't offer express.

 

[Clive]

I don't understand why they limit the express to just houses. It makes no sense. It would alleviate house lines a little if they allowed express for rides.

And yea, they are definitely overselling express. I guarantee they have a limit set, but oversell that amount most nights. It's insane and not really fair to the every day guest.

Every ride except for Rockit has an HHN Express line.

Something has to give with the express lines - they were nuts this weekend. Waited 30 minutes for Penn & Teller, and at more than a few points the Express line was longer than the standby line for Alice Cooper. Part of the problem is lack of scanners - the line gets backed up because the attendant can't scan the tickets fast enough. They need to get a second or third scanner out there to increase efficiency.

 

[Eric]

Every ride except for Rockit has an HHN Express line.

Something has to give with the express lines - they were nuts this weekend. Waited 30 minutes for Penn & Teller, and at more than a few points the Express line was longer than the standby line for Alice Cooper. Part of the problem is lack of scanners - the line gets backed up because the attendant can't scan the tickets fast enough. They need to get a second or third scanner out there to increase efficiency.

Ah, for some reason I was thinking they were just limited to the houses.

I say eliminate the scanners for HHN and find a more innovative way to push express through

 

[Hatetofly]

I hate what has become of express at HHN. It's a terrible process in every way. As mentioned the scanner can't keep up but the main problem IMO is a severe lack of training and communication. TM's are not communicating where the lines are at, if express is backed up past a certain point and so on. Also many TM's treat their scanners like some piece of alien hardware and management will walk right past those having issues each and every time.

Now after visiting HHN Hollywood I'm really upset about the process. I'm sorry and in no way do I mean any disrespect to any of our scareactors or Uni Orlando Team members but the Hollywood event has you beat in everyway possible this year. I will go into further details with my upcoming review but if the Orlando team wants some advice or some new creative tips visit the HW event and take notice of these key factors.

-Operations
From the front of the line passes to crowd control everything flowed and there were no hold ups. Also employee training, everyone knew what they were doing and kept much better order. Their scanners could outgun ours 10-1! On a sold out night I waited in the express line for more than 5 mins, once! Which was less than 10 btw.

-Creativity
I won't go into this so I can save it for my review but they do more with so much less its pathetic.

-Scares
The houses are without a doubt more creative when it comes to scares and I got more scares in one house in HW than I have at the Orlando event combined.

MURDY and his team need to come Orlando to give a seminar and show them what to improve upon.

 

[maxairmike]

Quick note about the scanners: they look to be from the 1980s! There is a ridiculously long delay on them, and it should not take 15+ seconds to scan a barcode and then receive a confirmation signal (I've seen it take longer). Something tells me the wireless infrastructure of the resort needs a massive boost, or they need to rethink how they manage Express usage (whether that be investing in new scanners, or coming up with a new method for managing it). In fact, I really se no reason for the attractions to use the mobile scanners. The houses need something a bit more mobile, but maybe the handheld scanners aren't the proper solution.

 

[Hockeyman55]

Now after visiting HHN Hollywood I'm really upset about the process. I'm sorry and in no way do I mean any disrespect to any of our scareactors or Uni Orlando Team members but the Hollywood event has you beat in everyway possible this year. I will go into further details with my upcoming review but if the Orlando team wants some advice or some new creative tips visit the HW event and take notice of these key factors.

It does help that everyone in LA wants to be an actor :rofl:

 

[Hatetofly]

Quick note about the scanners: they look to be from the 1980s! There is a ridiculously long delay on them, and it should not take 15+ seconds to scan a barcode and then receive a confirmation signal (I've seen it take longer). Something tells me the wireless infrastructure of the resort needs a massive boost, or they need to rethink how they manage Express usage (whether that be investing in new scanners, or coming up with a new method for managing it). In fact, I really se no reason for the attractions to use the mobile scanners. The houses need something a bit more mobile, but maybe the handheld scanners aren't the proper solution.

In Hollywood they had mobile computer stations at each house entrance.

 

[Eric]

In Hollywood they had mobile computer stations at each house entrance.

I'm curious, how does express work in Hollywood? I'm assuming no scanners because you say mobile computer stations...

 

[Hatetofly]

When you arrive you go to a separate security line and go through the turnstile where they give you a lanyard upon entering the park. The lanyard has a barcode on the back with a cool logo and list of all the attractions you can use your front of the line passes on. At each attraction or haunted house their is a separate entrance where their is a mobile computer station. At the station is two to three attendants where two are organizing the crowd and making sure your in the right place and having you get your pass out. The third person has a hand held scanner attached to a CPU with a flat screen and WIFI boosters.

Once the team member scans the pass, it comes back instantly whether or not your pass is valid. The scanner itself if I remember correctly are Motorola LS2 scanners that shoot out widespread light vs a single thin scanning beam. I would compare it to a 9MM round at Orlando vs Bird Shot at Hollywood. Their is no holding the pass at a certain direction or distance like in Orlando. In Hollywood they can scan it from almost anywhere and boom your through.

Its so much more efficient it hurts to think of how were doing it here.

 

[SeventyOne]

So you think if the crowd level keeps on this rising trend they would expand it to both parks like they did years ago? I personally wasn't a fan of when they held it at both parks, I felt it left a lot of dead space with no scare zones or actors around in certain areas.

I'd have to peruse Screamscape archives for the exact year (maybe 2008? right before the recession kicked in hard), but at one point, the surveys suggested a two-park "mega" event. I think it's sort of inevitable, but then again, if they didn't pull the trigger this year when they should have seen issues coming, not sure when they will.

When just MSHI was open there was a lot of dead space, but I think that was because it was a last minute decision. With proper planning, could use a mix of SZs, food booths, carnival games, etc.

I feel like their response this year will be to open superhero island, and most likely make an 8th house there next year if no space opens itself up at the studios. The biggest problem with crowds is that people are just going house to house with no reason to stop. And for those who have gone to the shows, is it typically a full house or are the shows not bringing in that big of a crowd.

Next year, Transformers will still have that "new ride" smell and seems like a people-eater. Also, more alleys will be opened up again, and given the mixed reaction this year, I expect at least some traditional SZs to return. That should help with crowds.

Re: a 2-park planned event, if they go to the trouble of opening MSHI, I imagine they also open JP and at least parts of TL to let people walk through. The extra walking space alone would also help alleviate crowds. But again, if they didn't do this in 2012, 2013 should be less of an issue, so I don't expect this for a few years yet.

Along those lines, has anyone ever solidly confirmed Potter Land(s) are completely off limits during HHN? IIRC, the contract is online, no? The potential use of either changes the equation.

As for shows, I don't think I've seen B&T run with a full house yet this year (of course, once the park gets too packed to walk, I leave), but usually at least 60 - 70% full. Both times I saw 20 Penny it largely filled the smaller BJ venue, but there were open seats at the edges. Multiply times six shows a night, I think they are helping with capacity some.

 

[Eric]

When you arrive you go to a separate security line and go through the turnstile where they give you a lanyard upon entering the park. The lanyard has a barcode on the back with a cool logo and list of all the attractions you can use your front of the line passes on. At each attraction or haunted house their is a separate entrance where their is a mobile computer station. At the station is two to three attendants where two are organizing the crowd and making sure your in the right place and having you get your pass out. The third person has a hand held scanner attached to a CPU with a flat screen and WIFI boosters.

Once the team member scans the pass, it comes back instantly whether or not your pass is valid. The scanner itself if I remember correctly are Motorola LS2 scanners that shoot out widespread light vs a single thin scanning beam. I would compare it to a 9MM round at Orlando vs Bird Shot at Hollywood. Their is no holding the pass at a certain direction or distance like in Orlando. In Hollywood they can scan it from almost anywhere and boom your through.

Its so much more efficient it hurts to think of how were doing it here.

This seems a heck of a lot more efficient. I'm surprised they don't bring this process to Orlando. Thanks for filling me in!

 

[ReelJustice]

Along those lines, has anyone ever solidly confirmed Potter Land(s) are completely off limits during HHN? IIRC, the contract is online, no? The potential use of either changes the equation.

It's not explicitly stated. The only reference is to special ticketed events, and in those cases, JKR/WB gets a cut of the gate. I'll go dig it up in a sec.

Here is the agreement: http://sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1262449/000119312507178559/dex1041.htm

 

[JungleSkip]

It's not explicitly stated. The only reference is to special ticketed events, and in those cases, JKR/WB gets a cut of the gate. I'll go dig it up in a sec.

Yup. That's the reason you won't see HHN in two parks until WWoHP 2.0 opens. They want to hoard all the money while they can.

 

[ReelJustice]

How do the IP houses work? Surely AMC et al are getting some sort of cut? Personally, I'd rather all Universal A&D created houses (Gothic, House of Horrors, and Dead End were superior to the others) and have Potter available. The agreement would need to be amended to include Dementors and Death Eaters (currently only generic Hogwarts Students are the only allowable characters.)

 

[SeventyOne]

Yup. That's the reason you won't see HHN in two parks until WWoHP 2.0 opens. They want to hoard all the money while they can.

That actually makes total sense. As I said, I wasn't sure why they didn't finally attempt the two-park approach this year knowing so much land would be off-limits. A cut of the gate for the whole event gives them hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of reasons to leave out IoA.

How do the IP houses work? Surely AMC et al are getting some sort of cut? Personally, I'd rather all Universal A&D created houses (Gothic, House of Horrors, and Dead End were superior to the others) and have Potter available. The agreement would need to be amended to include Dementors and Death Eaters (currently only generic Hogwarts Students are the only allowable characters.)

I would guess most are more of a flat fee arrangement--lately, most of the IP houses have essentially been free advertising so while I'm sure the IP owner gets something, it's more about the publicity and the "coolness" factor.

Even just a chance to visit WWoHP at night, without anything Halloweeny, would be a selling point. But yeah, mix in Death Eaters and Dementors and we'd have something amazing on our hands.

 

[Jakemeister]

That actually makes total sense. As I said, I wasn't sure why they didn't finally attempt the two-park approach this year knowing so much land would be off-limits. A cut of the gate for the whole event gives them hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of reasons to leave out IoA.



I would guess most are more of a flat fee arrangement--lately, most of the IP houses have essentially been free advertising so while I'm sure the IP owner gets something, it's more about the publicity and the "coolness" factor.

Even just a chance to visit WWoHP at night, without anything Halloweeny, would be a selling point. But yeah, mix in Death Eaters and Dementors and we'd have something amazing on our hands.

Things that happen in WWoHP have to have JK and WB's approval. Neither are exactly easy to please, neither are impossible to work with but they do have to follow strict guidelines for those properties.

On the topic of licensing, I think that Universal pays one flat fee, from there the other studio studio, AMC, New Line, Lion's Gate, gets a cut of merchandise profit from overall. As others have pointed out the big thing with making your property a haunted house is hype. It makes your property seem larger than life and gives the event and DVD sales a decent draw. It might not boost your next films profits, but it definitely rekindles interest.

 

[SeventyOne]

Thursday (10/11) update...

Crowds/lines even worse than Sunday somehow. By 6:10, Silent Hill queue was almost to the boneyard, Gothic grew a huge line just behind it. (Meanwhile, the back half of the park stayed empty until past 7:00.) By 9 - 10, TWD topped out at 120 minutes*, other houses seemed to be in the 60 - 75 minute range. And I'm not sure those numbers weren't lowballed, every house tonight had a line longer than posted.

Even Bill & Ted was packed tonight. No overt mention of the "political scandal" but I found it interesting Romney's back-up babe now wears the same Capt. America-esque outfit at Obama's, ditching the school marm with granny panties look. Fairly certain it was the same actress, and rap/dialogue were unchanged, so not sure of the point.

Hoarde Scareactors are finding their groove, but still too easy for them to get lost when it gets crowded (in fairness, this is also true of the non-roaming walkers). Nor is it particularly easy to find them when you want to just chill and watch people get scared.

House of Horrors impressed me tonight, strong cast trying for scares. On the flip side, Penn & Teller disappoints me more each visit. Tonight, the projector in the queue was not working, nor were the video screens in the finale. Couldn't hear Penn's commentary, either, and the cast just didn't feel into it.

I still don't get Silent Hill.

*--Online fanbois, me included, poo-pooed TWD when it was announced. But whatever Universal exec pushed for that property is going to be getting a nice Christmas bonus this year, talk about a hit.