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Possible Imagination Overhaul

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gass3268
  • Start date Start date Jul 22, 2013
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Cole

Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #161
JungleSkip said:
Yes, god forbid you MAKE them care by building an awesome attraction.
Click to expand...
It's not disney it's the GP, they are why horror nights is the way it is, they are why the film industry is the way it is and soon it'll be why disney is the way it is. The world is slowly becoming more commercial every day and that's just the way it is. You don't like it? Neither do I but hey there's no stopping the unstoppable
 
Brian G.

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #162
Cole said:
It's not disney it's the GP, they are why horror nights is the way it is, they are why the film industry is the way it is and soon it'll be why disney is the way it is. The world is slowly becoming more commercial every day and that's just the way it is. You don't like it? Neither do I but hey there's no stopping the unstoppable
Click to expand...

You do realize you're complaining in one thread about creativity at HHN but taking the opposite stance in another, right?
 
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Cole

Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #163
BriMan said:
You do realize you're complaining in one thread about creativity at HHN but taking the opposite stance in another, right?
Click to expand...
It's different, horror nights can be whatever it wants to be because it's only up for a month. That and disney isn't doing the same thing 4 years in a row. One's a special event only avalable once a year and the other will be around for decades. I also care more about horror nights than I ever will about epcot
 
Brian G.

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #164
Cole said:
It's different, horror nights can be whatever it wants to be because it's only up for a month. That and disney isn't doing the same thing 4 years in a row. One's a special event only avalable once a year and the other will be around for decades
Click to expand...

It is different, yes - but HHN only has 30 days to maximize profits. Hence why you get Walking Dead 4 years in a row.
 
Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #165
BriMan said:
It is different, yes - but HHN only has 30 days to maximize profits. Hence why you get Walking Dead 4 years in a row.
Click to expand...
very true, but we've had 4 years to judge TWD at horror nights. You all are judging something that isn't even close to coming out. Not giving something a slither of a chance because it's an IP is unfair. Especially when it's a great IP that fits in the area perfectly
 
JungleSkip

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #166
Cole said:
very true, but we've had 4 years to judge TWD at horror nights. You all are judging something that isn't even close to coming out. Not giving something a slither of a chance because it's an IP is unfair. Especially when it's a great IP that fits in the area perfectly
Click to expand...

I'm not saying it can't be good.

I'm saying it does nothing to get me interested in going back to Epcot. I don't really care how good it is. I've only got a certain amount of vacation time, and nothing rumored for Epcot is vying for that vacation time.
 
Brian G.

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #167
Cole said:
very true, but we've had 4 years to judge TWD at horror nights. You all are judging something that isn't even close to coming out. Not giving something a slither of a chance because it's an IP is unfair. Especially when it's a great IP that fits in the area perfectly
Click to expand...

I'm not judging it. I'm OK with Inside Out at Epcot. Just stating the whole Epcot lost its way argument. Skip is just taking the hard stance to it.
 
Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #168
JungleSkip said:
I'm not saying it can't be good.

I'm saying it does nothing to get me interested in going back to Epcot. I don't really care how good it is. I've only got a certain amount of vacation time, and nothing rumored for Epcot is vying for that vacation time.
Click to expand...
you'll go on it eventually and it'll be good. Also you are in the minority, inside out is currently the third highest grossing pixar film (witch is really saying something). It'll bring tons of people in no matter what
 
JungleSkip

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  • #169
Cole said:
you'll go on it eventually and it'll be good. Also you are in the minority, inside out is currently the third highest grossing pixar film (witch is really saying something). It'll bring tons of people in no matter what
Click to expand...

Tell me where in my posts I said it wouldn't? I didn't. Right. Because it's MY OPINION.
 
Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #170
JungleSkip said:
Tell me where in my posts I said it wouldn't? I didn't. Right. Because it's MY OPINION.
Click to expand...
I know it is, it's just a closeminded one. If it turns out awesome and everybody is raving about it, you still won't go because it's an IP at epcot? You were the same person who said JW wouldn't work for the theme parks a literal month before the movie came out. Loosen up man
 
JungleSkip

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #171
Cole said:
I know it is, it's just a closeminded one. If it turns out awesome and everybody is raving about it, you still won't go because it's an IP at epcot? You were the same person who said JW wouldn't work for the theme parks a literal month before the movie came out. Loosen up man
Click to expand...

No, I won't go because EPCOT has nothing I want to see, and Inside Out doesn't change that, no matter the quality. It'd be going up against Star Wars, MK additions, DAK, Kong, Nintendo, F&F, etc, and it's not going to win against them. Now a brand new, high quality Figment ride? I'm there.

Not sure what you're saying about JW. I said I'd rather keep Jurassic Park because it's a better and more classic movie, and that another JP E-ticket would be more of the same (I still stand behind that), but that's about it.
 
Cole

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #172
JungleSkip said:
No, I won't go because EPCOT has nothing I want to see, and Inside Out doesn't change that, no matter the quality. It'd be going up against Star Wars, MK additions, DAK, Kong, Nintendo, F&F, etc, and it's not going to win against them. Now a brand new, high quality Figment ride? I'm there.

Not sure what you're saying about JW. I said I'd rather keep Jurassic Park because it's a better and more classic movie, and that another JP E-ticket would be more of the same (I still stand behind that), but that's about it.
Click to expand...
You said that before JW even came out, not giving it a chance whatsoever. Yeah inside out has some fierce competition but again who knows when this will come out? It'll probably have a stand alone year, not all of those are coming out at once. It's a ride replacing the imagination pavillion. Figment or inside out, you are gonna get the same basic thing just different characters and theming. It's gonna be an insanely creative adventure through someones mind, same basic concept either way!!!! Yeah figment is classic but his track record sucks, he isn't as gold as most think he is. Inside out is relevant, fits the theming and most important of all, really friggin good. It just works
 
rhino4evr

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #173
I go to theme parks for theme park attractions. I wouldn't let an "IP" nor "the parks original intentions 3 decades ago" stop me from enjoying myself if the attraction is solid.
That doesn't mean I don't want original attractions, it just means I wouldn't stick my head in the sand just because they aren't following some "theme park code" ...sorry, just find that silly and close minded. I realize it's your opinion. So we can just agree to disagree.
 
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JungleSkip

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  • #174
rhino4evr said:
I go to theme parks for theme park attractions. I wouldn't let an "IP" nor "the parks original intentions 3 decades ago" stop me from enjoying myself if the attraction is solid.
Click to expand...

*sigh*

Again, I'm sure I would enjoy it! But in the grand scheme of things, I'm not wasting time in EPCOT when it interests me the least out of basically every other park in Orlando.
 
ChristopherSE

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #175
Just my 2 cents, Everest and Soarin' were 2 original attractions that the GP went nuts over. I mean, are we seriously going to deny Soarin's draw (regardless of whether or not it's justified)? I know you guys know the wait times that thing has :lol: So to say the GP will only get excited about IPs, I think, is not giving them enough credit. Do they get more excited about WWoHP? Well, obviously. But honestly, I believe the right original attraction could get the public more excited than, say, Avatarland. Of course, corporate may not see it that way, but I don't know how much we can do about that :shrug:

I do want EPCOT to return, at least somewhat, to what it was. And I don't want Frozen in WS. That being said, I don't mind Inside Out taking over Imagination, solely because it just fits so darn well and the characters very much remind me of the kind of attractions we miss. The easy to understand and totally endearing archetypes that lend themselves perfectly to teaching about emotions and imagination. Had there not been a movie, I feel they would be exactly what everyone wanted. But because of the fear of the IP takeover (which I very much fear, too), the idea has been cast aside perhaps a bit too quickly.
 
rhino4evr

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  • #176
hairyleo said:
Just my 2 cents, Everest and Soarin' were 2 original attractions that the GP went nuts over. I mean, are we seriously going to deny Soarin's draw (regardless of whether or not it's justified)? I know you guys know the wait times that thing has :lol: So to say the GP will only get excited about IPs, I think, is not giving them enough credit. Do they get more excited about WWoHP? Well, obviously. But honestly, I believe the right original attraction could get the public more excited than, say, Avatarland. Of course, corporate may not see it that way, but I don't know how much we can do about that :shrug:

I do want EPCOT to return, at least somewhat, to what it was. And I don't want Frozen in WS. That being said, I don't mind Inside Out taking over Imagination, solely because it just fits so darn well and the characters very much remind me of the kind of attractions we miss. The easy to understand and totally endearing archetypes that lend themselves perfectly to teaching about emotions and imagination. Had there not been a movie, I feel they would be exactly what everyone wanted. But because of the fear of the IP takeover (which I very much fear, too), the idea has been cast aside perhaps a bit too quickly.
Click to expand...

I agree that the general public still lines up for rides like Test Track and Soarin, but how much merchandise do you think they sell?
Would a "Joy" doll sell better then an aviator cap?

Potter completely changed the theme park game, and I see all future large theme park investments tied into some sort of merchandise/food item IP business.
 
misterID

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  • #177
Cole said:
You said that before JW even came out, not giving it a chance whatsoever. Yeah inside out has some fierce competition but again who knows when this will come out? It'll probably have a stand alone year, not all of those are coming out at once. It's a ride replacing the imagination pavillion. Figment or inside out, you are gonna get the same basic thing just different characters and theming. It's gonna be an insanely creative adventure through someones mind, same basic concept either way!!!! Yeah figment is classic but his track record sucks, he isn't as gold as most think he is. Inside out is relevant, fits the theming and most important of all, really friggin good. It just works
Click to expand...
last I heard figment was still a top merch seller. And I would disagree, his track record doesn't suck, Tom Fitzgerald's does. Inside Out would fit nicely in WOL.
 
ChristopherSE

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #178
rhino4evr said:
Would a "Joy" doll sell better then an aviator cap? Potter completely changed the theme park game, and I see all future large theme park investments tied into some sort of merchandise/food item IP business.
Click to expand...

misterID said:
last I heard figment was still a top merch seller. And I would disagree, his track record doesn't suck, Tom Fitzgerald's does. Inside Out would fit nicely in WOL.
Click to expand...

True, movies will sell more, but attractions still have a market. I mean, look at ToT. Yes, it's technically an IP, but all the merchandise (and there is a lot of it, with even more added just last month) is specifically for the ride and certainly sells well. And as excited as these parks are for merchandise opportunities after Potter changed the game, there will never be an IP that can be used the same way. The merchandise/food IP business will definitely work its way into all theme parks (it already has), but it will run out of steam. Potter is an outlier and I think corporate and GP are catching on. Obviously, it can and will still work in small doses (like La feu's Brew and the Carsland specialties) but they can easily be applied to original attractions. The only reason Butterbeer and wands sell so unbelievably well is because they already exist in the GPs mind. Disney's "responses" have been invented and slapped on the next available IP (the Beauty and the Beast brew was just borrowed from cars land anyway). Merchandise for IPs will boom as soon as the ride opens, for sure. Much more than an original attraction. But after a while, a Joy doll won't be much more significant than a figment doll.

I know IPs are marketable. But, Skip has a point. Why not make EPCOT marketable as IP-free (or, at least, not over-run by characters). Movies have always been huge draws. The Fantasyland that opened with Disneyland in the 50's used IPs. Yet, original attractions have still been marketable for the past 60 years? If IPs and original attractions could exist in harmony for so long, why should now be any different? Saying "the GP wants it" is a cop out, I think. If you churn out a bunch of great things, whether they're IPs or not, the GP will want more of it. Just because the GP "wants" IPs now doesn't mean much, because that's really all they've been given. Now they're just used to it.
 
*Q*

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #179
If Disney were smart, they would work better to blur the lines between the various types of media that these intellectual properties are derived from. In this world where technology is integrating movies, television, and other entertainment across all of these platforms more and more, it is somewhat an issue of semantics when we talk about using IPs in EPCOT and such. Everything that Disney creates is an intellectual property whether it starts in a movie, television show, theme park, or whatever. EPCOT itself and many of the attractions that have been developed within over the years are also IPs, so it becomes more an issue of discussing which pre-existing IP's are appropriate to use in the park, and when it's appropriate to develop new IP's that could potentially spur a multimedia franchise. This has already been proven that it can be possible and even very successful with the Pirates of the Caribbean franchise. Again, if Disney were a little more wise, they would experiment with this a lot more. Perhaps the comic book is an indication that they are starting to test the waters of using this IP more, but I could easily see a Journey Into Imagination family adventure movie franchise spun out of the classic theme park attraction. Or a travelogue television series themed to World Showcase. Or a car design simulator game themed to Test Track. Inside Out has the potential to be an appropriate IP used in EPCOT, but for it to be done correctly they would have to use those characters as a vessel to explore the inner workings of your mind and/or body, and not just rehash the movie the way the Finding Nemo ride does and I'm sure the Frozen ride will. Shoehorning Frozen into World Showcase is just lazy, and doesn't serve either IP well in the long run. Certainly much, much more profit would be made if a dedicated land were built for Frozen in one of the other three parks (a case could be made for all of them, admittedly some more than others), and a new country built in World Showcase.
 
Mad Dog

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  • Aug 3, 2015
  • #180
They probably did Frozen on the cheap so they could get an attraction done sooner and capitalize on it's present popularity. If WDW attempted to develop a huge immersive Froxen land similar to the Diagon quality, at their normal development and building speed, the Scandinavian winter snows would probably be Florida type palms with the pace of global warming. :faint:
 
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