The State of Epcot

[Mad Dog]

I've heard something new too: Universal is going to wait for Disney to build the ride to litigate as a physical attraction is the ultimate breach of contract. There is no "negotiations".

Universal lawyers are chomping at the bit, waiting to kick Disney butt. The only problem is that it takes Disney so long to build anything, the lawyers will all be retired collecting social security.

 

[AlexanderMBush]

Universal lawyers are chomping at the bit, waiting to kick Disney butt. The only problem is that it takes Disney so long to build anything, the lawyers will all be retired collecting social security.

No, the lawyer's Children will be then suing Disney. THINK ABOUT THE CIRCLE OF LIFE!!

 

[Mad Dog]

No, the lawyer's Children will be then suing Disney. THINK ABOUT THE CIRCLE OF LIFE!!

Good one.

 

[Imperius]

So the bi-yearly Universal selling Marvel rumors are back.

 

[AlexanderMBush]

So the bi-yearly Universal selling Marvel rumors are back.

To be honest, if any deals of Universal/TWDC are happening; I would imagine that it wouldn't be Universal selling the Marvel theme park rights at all..

 

[Mr. EPCOT]

I've heard something new too: Universal is going to wait for Disney to build the ride to litigate as a physical attraction is the ultimate breach of contract. There is no "negotiations".

What do you think would be the endgame that Universal's shooting for in that scenario?

 

[AlexanderMBush]

What do you think would be the endgame that Universal's shooting for in that scenario?

One of the things most obviously would be money..but I would imagine that there would potentially be something else that they want out of it if they do what Joe is saying..

 

[Parkscope Joe]

What do you think would be the endgame that Universal's shooting for in that scenario?

Having litigation behind the contract. @SeventyOne and @ReelJustice can help more here but it's my belief that having a judging decision adds weight and teeth to the contract to stand on.

Additionally, I think Disney pushing this attraction is an Emperor Has No Clothes sort of situation. I've heard a coaster is coming but they've been treading lightly with it ever being GotG. That's why I don't believe it will be GotG, even if it was a possible option. But if it does go that angle Disney will be in breach of contract and Universal has every intention to let them build it, get an injection to not let them open or advertise it, and then get a ruling months or years later for them.

 

[s8film40]

Having litigation behind the contract. @SeventyOne and @ReelJustice can help more here but it's my belief that having a judging decision adds weight and teeth to the contract to stand on.

Additionally, I think Disney pushing this attraction is an Emperor Has No Clothes sort of situation. I've heard a coaster is coming but they've been treading lightly with it ever being GotG. That's why I don't believe it will be GotG, even if it was a possible option. But if it does go that angle Disney will be in breach of contract and Universal has every intention to let them build it, get an injection to not let them open or advertise it, and then get a ruling months or years later for them.

The only problem with this is typically with these type of things the court simply awards damages. It doesn't mean they would have to take the ride out and once it's there Disney gets what they want and Universal just gets some extra money, which would only be tied up in appeals for years and years. Take for example the Apple vs. Samsung case. Samsung ripped of the iPhone. The court awarded Apple billions of dollars but Samsung is still making their knockoff iPhones.

 

[jtsalien]

Having litigation behind the contract. @SeventyOne and @ReelJustice can help more here but it's my belief that having a judging decision adds weight and teeth to the contract to stand on.

Additionally, I think Disney pushing this attraction is an Emperor Has No Clothes sort of situation. I've heard a coaster is coming but they've been treading lightly with it ever being GotG. That's why I don't believe it will be GotG, even if it was a possible option. But if it does go that angle Disney will be in breach of contract and Universal has every intention to let them build it, get an injection to not let them open or advertise it, and then get a ruling months or years later for them.

I'm not saying it's likely, but isn't it possible to negotiate a shared custody-type deal like the Spiderman deal with Sony? Reduce or negate the annual fee, and maybe some nice merchandise discounts or something?

 

[Nick]

I've heard something new too: Universal is going to wait for Disney to build the ride to litigate as a physical attraction is the ultimate breach of contract. There is no "negotiations".

They also can't wait for them to build the attraction, after it would've been announced, and then hit them up 2-3 years later with a lawsuit. If Disney announces something publicly, that's the warning shot. Universal can't wait for a physical attraction to be built when they'd have known full well for years PUBLICLY that it's happening.

That's if anything happens at all.

 

[Galaxy Defender]

The Frozen ride did not help EPCOT the way Disney hoped it would. This plan is starting to smack of desperation.

 

[Nick]

The Frozen ride did not help EPCOT the way Disney hoped it would. This plan is starting to smack of desperation.

I think we should all be glad it didn't help the way they wanted. It means all parks that aren't MK continue to struggle which will force actual investment.

 

[Galaxy Defender]

I think we should all be glad it didn't help the way they wanted. It means all parks that aren't MK continue to struggle which will force actual investment.

I believe this failure to increase EPCOT traffic using their big gun Frozen IP has WDW in panic mode. I don't know what will be built at EPCOT, but they are going to build/overlay with multiple IP attractions and do it as fast as they can.

WDW is in for a rough few years attendance wise.

 

[Mad Dog]

I believe this failure to increase EPCOT traffic using their big gun Frozen IP has WDW in panic mode. I don't know what will be built at EPCOT, but they are going to build/overlay with multiple IP attractions and do it as fast as they can.

WDW is in for a rough few years attendance wise.

Yep. MK still does well, but the other three parks really appear to be struggling. It looks like Frozen really didn't bring any additional traffic into the park. The ride lines are probably long because capacity is so poor & the ride breaks down often. And the Meet & Greet lines are only a fraction of what they were when Anna & Elsa were in MK. That M&G short lines speaks volumes.

 

[SeventyOne]

Having litigation behind the contract. @SeventyOne and @ReelJustice can help more here but it's my belief that having a judging decision adds weight and teeth to the contract to stand on.

Additionally, I think Disney pushing this attraction is an Emperor Has No Clothes sort of situation. I've heard a coaster is coming but they've been treading lightly with it ever being GotG. That's why I don't believe it will be GotG, even if it was a possible option. But if it does go that angle Disney will be in breach of contract and Universal has every intention to let them build it, get an injection to not let them open or advertise it, and then get a ruling months or years later for them.

While I do think Universal (and Disney) would prefer clarification on the contract, if there is the slightest chance of this happening, no way Disney Legal allows it to go forward. They would all be bounced from their coushy jobs, possibly even disbarred.

Also, not sure Universal wants to poke the bear too much. While 99% unlikely, a super narrow reading of the contract could put them in a worse place than they are now (for example, arbitrator says cut-outs not enough, you don't actually own Iron Man--just a hypothetical, but arbitration is free-wheeling, could go in any direction). Not to mention it would take years.

Finally, I still think Star-Lord and Gamora are fine, probably even Rocket. Building the ride with just them no problem. Advertising it between Miami and Atlanta--that is where the issue will come up.

 

[AlexanderMBush]

While I do think Universal (and Disney) would prefer clarification on the contract, if there is the slightest chance of this happening, no way Disney Legal allows it to go forward. They would all be bounced from their coushy jobs, possibly even disbarred.

Also, not sure Universal wants to poke the bear too much. While 99% unlikely, a super narrow reading of the contract could put them in a worse place than they are now (for example, arbitrator says cut-outs not enough, you don't actually own Iron Man--just a hypothetical, but arbitration is free-wheeling, could go in any direction). Not to mention it would take years.

Finally, I still think Star-Lord and Gamora are fine, probably even Rocket. Building the ride with just them no problem. Advertising it between Miami and Atlanta--that is where the issue will come up.

Mind if I ask, is anything west of Alanta and south of Miami then fine or does it go for the entire eastern coast line that they can't advertise anything Marvel oriented?

 

[SeventyOne]

Mind if I ask, is anything west of Alanta and south of Miami then fine or does it go for the entire eastern coast line that they can't advertise anything Marvel oriented?

Media markets 300 miles from IoA. So just using Miami and Atlanta as illustrative guideposts of approximate distance, not literally those city borders.

 

[belloq87]

It's really hard to get a handle on what - if anything - is actually going to be happening to this park within the next five years. Elsewhere, marni1971 has been alternately guardedly optimistic and pessimistic about what he's heard is coming (going so far as to basically say the park will be an IP-fest with little thought given to theme).

As with other decisions being made for other parks, it seems Disney is almost actively trying to avoid addressing/"fixing" the major issues, which is baffling because - from where I'm sitting - it would be easy to do, and very feasible to balance the company's desire for IP-based, exciting rides with an edutainment sort of spirit that gives a nod of the head to the park's legacy.

 

[Galaxy Defender]

It's really hard to get a handle on what - if anything - is actually going to be happening to this park within the next five years. Elsewhere, marni1971 has been alternately guardedly optimistic and pessimistic about what he's heard is coming (going so far as to basically say the park will be an IP-fest with little thought given to theme).

As with other decisions being made for other parks, it seems Disney is almost actively trying to avoid addressing/"fixing" the major issues, which is baffling because - from where I'm sitting - it would be easy to do, and very feasible to balance the company's desire for IP-based, exciting rides with an edutainment sort of spirit that gives a nod of the head to the park's legacy.

There is a strategy to the improvements in the other three WDW parks. There is no such plan for EPCOT, just a realization it needs help quick.

Unless they take some time to come up with such a plan we will continue to see ideas flying left and right. I think WDW is currently unwilling to spend the money on EPCOT it is putting in DAK and DHS. It is more likely changes are on a Pavilion by Pavilion basis.