Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[JungleSkip]

I think this resort will fix a lot of the issues that the current resort has. One of the issues is the distance from the parking to the parks.

Something like this could work.

The distance to the parks from parking currently is a feature, not a bug. It's meant to ensure guests walk through CityWalk in order to get to/from the parks. I don't see that changing.

 

[Sithina]

If the Apts are just rentals, I would think the lease agreement would preclude subletting, but I don't know the nuances of Florida/Orlando real estate law.

Here in the US, a lot of it actually depends on State and City laws. In MO, for instance, they can't sell a townhouse or apartment out from under you without certain requirements being met, and (somewhat) advance notice being given--more than the 30 days that are standard. However, in the state of Indiana (the city of Indy, where our friends live, for sure, though I think it's a statewide law), for instance, renters do not have this protection. If you are renting a house/apartment/townhouse, even within a large complex, if they owners sell or are bought out, you can be forced to move immediately. I think it's 24 hours? Not sure. That law, or lack of, always seemed crazy to me, but it happened to our friends when the house they'd been living in was sold and they had to be out within the week. I'm not sure what FL's laws are.

Given all the existing plots and buildings they have to block out already, the apartments are a small worry. I can't see them buying the complex out, but I know nothing about the market. Where I'm from (IL, outside of Chicago), one of the local hospitals is slowly buying out the houses around their largest campus--it's not the best area, but not bad, and the houses are all in good repair--as the houses go to market, and changing them into apartments (not hard to do with the style from that era of building), then renting them out to their staff at the hospital. Here in MO, Big Cedar Resort (owned by Johnny Morris, through Bass Pro--another huge company with deep pockets) owns quite a lot of the houses around it, and he rents them out to his upper-level staff at the resorts and golf courses, or to long-term employees.

 

[JungleSkip]

I feel like the plots of land next to the apartments are the most likely spots for the garages. They will offer little else of uses, and ensures the garages won't take up space that can be used for guest areas.

 

[Scott W.]

The distance to the parks from parking currently is a feature, not a bug. It's meant to ensure guests walk through CityWalk in order to get to/from the parks. I don't see that changing.

I don't mind the CityWalk part at all, I understand the reason why it's done. Parking in the back corner though, you can be walking up to 2/3 of a mile to get to IOA. I know they have moving walkways but when it's busy, it can be a nightmare.

 

[Sithina]

I think this resort will fix a lot of the issues that the current resort has. One of the issues is the distance from the parking to the parks.

Something like this could work.

I thought that was mold, initially, and had to enlarge the image to see the trees. Hopefully they don't go with that type of mural, lol. :tease: But yes, those types of murals are what I was thinking of--either generic background landscape type stuff, or going the complete opposite direction and theming them out to whatever area they face.

 

[Mad Dog]

I think this resort will fix a lot of the issues that the current resort has. One of the issues is the distance from the parking to the parks.

Something like this could work.



Las Palmeras by Hilton Grand Vacations just up the road will have some killer views from what I can see on Trip Advisor, it also shows the issue that the Orlando Eye can cause:

View attachment 7367 View attachment 7368

Heh, let the Eye show. People will wander around the new park thinking the Eye is in the park. Just like they look for Potter up in WDW. I can see a tourist now, "let's take that back alley over there behind Zelda's, maybe that path will take us to The Eye. I just gotta ride that."......and , love those Las Palmeras rooms' lake (retention pond) view. Too bad that's going away pretty soon.

 

[Teebin]

I actually think the parking garages at UOR are beautiful on top of being jaw dropping in size. Far more attractive than the hundreds of acres of searing asphalt at the mouse parks.

 

[Scott W.]

I actually think the parking garages at UOR are beautiful on top of being jaw dropping in size. Far more attractive than the hundreds of acres of searing asphalt at the mouse parks.

I find it incredible that they're 20 years old and still look modern.

 

[Ridgepole]

I find it incredible that they're 20 years old and still look modern.

have you seen the Roman bridges and aquaducts in southern Europe?:celebrate:

 

[Mad Dog]

have you seen the Roman bridges and aquaducts in southern Europe?:celebrate:

They're a 'couple years' older.

 

[s8film40]

If the Apts are just rentals, I would think the lease agreement would preclude subletting, but I don't know the nuances of Florida/Orlando real estate law. Very common in the US for one person/entity to own/control massive Apt complexes

Heres the lease agreement and yes it precludes subletting.
Sample Lease & Addendums - The Courtney at Universal Boulevard - LUXURY APARTMENT HOMES

Now since they're all rentals they cold pretty easily convert to condos or just an outright vacation resort. I'm not sure I see that happening though. This is pretty much Universal site B's version of the Bell Apartments and those haven't converted or anything.

Now the townhouse and condos across the street I could definitely see being used as vacation homes (if they aren't already) assuming they allow short term rentals and I would assume they do. I was actually just in one of those recently to take photos, they'll be great vacation homes with some good amenities included since they have that row of shops and stuff located there mixed in with them.

 

[zg44]

Universal isn't going to be buying up the apartments nearby... heck they had chances to buy that land before they were being built and passed (that tells you what you need to know).

The only land I see Universal having interest in are the 2 large plots that Stan Thomas kept after their transaction on Universal Blvd that are next to or in-between Universal-owned land. That's it.

Maybe if Rosen Shingle Creek is ever for sale, Universal would put in an offer for that. But random apartment complexes on lands that they could have bought before the apartments were constructed? Why would they buy that?

 

[Scott W.]

Universal isn't going to be buying up the apartments nearby... heck they had chances to buy that land before they were being built and passed (that tells you what you need to know).

The only land I see Universal having interest in are the 2 large plots that Stan Thomas kept after their transaction on Universal Blvd that are next to or in-between Universal-owned land. That's it.

Maybe if Rosen Shingle Creek is ever for sale, Universal would put in an offer for that. But random apartment complexes on lands that they could have bought before the apartments were constructed? Why would they buy that?

Is Rosen Shingle Creek the one with the golf course?

 

[Ridgepole]

Universal isn't going to be buying up the apartments nearby... heck they had chances to buy that land before they were being built and passed (that tells you what you need to know).


The only land I see Universal having interest in are the 2 large plots that Stan Thomas kept after their transaction on Universal Blvd that are next to or in-between Universal-owned land. That's it.

Maybe if Rosen Shingle Creek is ever for sale, Universal would put in an offer for that. But random apartment complexes on lands that they could have bought before the apartments were constructed? Why would they buy that?

i don't think the Apts are randomly located. And I believe one manifistation of the current comcas t owned that land. I was only thinking that REAQUIRING it might be a no brainer. But I defer to the local brains on the subject

 

[IAmFloridaBorn]

Just going by the re organization of the retention ponds on the right side of the plot, do people think the first phase of the work will go on that side? Maybe with the main entrance coming off Destination Parkway?

This is what I was thinking.

 

[IAmFloridaBorn]

Is Rosen Shingle Creek the one with the golf course?

Yes, And Shingle Creek is going to be expanding soon.

 

[Sithina]

Yes, And Shingle Creek is going to be expanding soon.

Makes sense for the owners to expand, especially now, though where are they expanding to? Wasn't there a plot of land that Universal bought behind the golf course? I'll have to dig back a few (...or more) pages to find the image of the land UO purchased to be sure. That doesn't mean SC doesn't own their own large plots of expansion land, of course.

I don't see why Universal wouldn't already be in talks with the owners of that golf course to possibly offer golf perks for UO resort guests at that course, being so close to Site B. Doesn't Universal do this already with their current resort? I don't golf, so I've never looked into it.

As for acquiring as much land as they can, even beyond the couple plots they didn't get from the Stan Thomas lawsuit, I guess I've just lived here in SW MO long enough to assume all resort owners are like Johnny Morris, who has his eye on ALL the land around his Big Cedar/Top of the Rock/Dogwood Canyon resort area. He'd buy everything if he could, even if he'd never use all of it, mostly to keep anyone else from developing it. He already owns quite a lot of it as it is--there are a number of holdouts, hoping he'll buy their properties at the much-inflated price they are going for (there's actually a pretty well known plot of land, about 3/4 of an acre, total, that the owners refuse to sell and that JM refuses to buy because he won't pay the almost $800,000--no joke, and that is a crazy price for land around these parts; it's not Orlando--they want for that 3/4 acre, even though it's almost in the middle of that side of the resort; JM's got some nice fences around it, though, so it really is just a plot of dead land in the middle of nowhere. Stubbornness all around, really.) So, yeah, not saying Universal has their eye on all those surrounding plots and properties, or that they'd even need to buy them (they really don't), just that it's not totally unheard of for resort companies to do just that to keep anyone else from developing the land.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

Makes sense for the owners to expand, especially now, though where are they expanding to? Wasn't there a plot of land that Universal bought behind the golf course? I'll have to dig back a few (...or more) pages to find the image of the land UO purchased to be sure. That doesn't mean SC doesn't own their own large plots of expansion land, of course.

I don't see why Universal wouldn't already be in talks with the owners of that golf course to possibly offer golf perks for UO resort guests at that course, being so close to Site B. Doesn't Universal do this already with their current resort? I don't golf, so I've never looked into it.

As for acquiring as much land as they can, even beyond the couple plots they didn't get from the Stan Thomas lawsuit, I guess I've just lived here in SW MO long enough to assume all resort owners are like Johnny Morris, who has his eye on ALL the land around his Big Cedar/Top of the Rock/Dogwood Canyon resort area. He'd buy everything if he could, even if he'd never use all of it, mostly to keep anyone else from developing it. He already owns quite a lot of it as it is--there are a number of holdouts, hoping he'll buy their properties at the much-inflated price they are going for (there's actually a pretty well known plot of land, about 3/4 of an acre, total, that the owners refuse to sell and that JM refuses to buy because he won't pay the almost $800,000--no joke, and that is a crazy price for land around these parts; it's not Orlando--they want for that 3/4 acre, even though it's almost in the middle of that side of the resort; JM's got some nice fences around it, though, so it really is just a plot of dead land in the middle of nowhere. Stubbornness all around, really.) So, yeah, not saying Universal has their eye on all those surrounding plots and properties, or that they'd even need to buy them (they really don't), just that it's not totally unheard of for resort companies to do just that to keep anyone else from developing the land.

Would not be surprised if Universal ends up partnering with Shingle Creek to be considered "on-site" the same way the Swan & Dolphins are considered Disney World hotels even though they are not Disney. That quickly adds a golf course to the resort.

 

[s8film40]

I guess the question is what kind of relationship does Mr. Rosen have with Universal and how willing is he to incorporate his hotel into the resort? I think at least some of the hotels are already Universal partner hotels right?

He seems pretty persistent naming the hotels after himself and maintaining his influence over them. Shingle Creek is his kind of crown jewel so to speak so I absolutely wouldn’t expect it to become something like “Universal’s Shingle Creek resort” or even “Rosen’s Shingle Creek at Universal”. Now business is business and a mutual partnership absolutely makes sense, but I suspect he’ll want to maintain a seperate identity. There’s also the issue that Universal and Lowe’s are essentially competition so that complicates things. However if Universal was interested in turning over their Lowe’s hotel operations to him I’m sure they could get a lot out of a deal with that.

 

[Sithina]

I guess the question is what kind of relationship does Mr. Rosen have with Universal and how willing is he to incorporate his hotel into the resort? I think at least some of the hotels are already Universal partner hotels right?

He seems pretty persistent naming the hotels after himself and maintaining his influence over them. Shingle Creek is his kind of crown jewel so to speak so I absolutely wouldn’t expect it to become something like “Universal’s Shingle Creek resort” or even “Rosen’s Shingle Creek at Universal”. Now business is business and a mutual partnership absolutely makes sense, but I suspect he’ll want to maintain a seperate identity. There’s also the issue that Universal and Lowe’s are essentially competition so that complicates things. However if Universal was interested in turning over their Lowe’s hotel operations to him I’m sure they could get a lot out of a deal with that.

Hmm...so the Johnny Morris of Orlando, then? If he's that particular, then I could see an agreement between them not working out. Not without a lot of negotiation, anyway, and what would be in it for Universal? Would Universal even lose a lot of business without some sort of golf course ticket, or would they just keep with the courses they have deals with now, and extend that perk to their UOSouth resort? I've only seen UOR as a possible golf destination through a few packages on their website.

Loews and Universal seem to have a mutually beneficial arrangement going and Universal needs a Premium at their new resort--is there any reason they wouldn't continue to use Loews? I don't see many rumblings about bad blood or shady dealings or anything--their standards seem to mesh at the current UOR.