Dear Evan Hansen

[shiekra38]

The music is really, really, REALLY good and deeply emotionally affecting if you're in high school or early college (speaking from experience).

A sizeable contingent of people have an emotional attachment to the IP. And I stress again: the music is so, so good.

I listened to the music...and...

I wondered off and started listening to A Star is Born again

 

[Legacy]

The comments on the YouTube trailer and on Facebook are rather positive

Everyone is "OMG Cryinggg"

I don't get it ya'll, this one missed me lol

Like we’ve been saying: the music is so catchy and approachable the flaws in the story are easily missed. Literally, as I’m complaining about the damn show I’m listening to the soundtrack. And so much effort is put into establishing Evan as a awkward outsider the good that comes his way through the show comes across as finally deserved instead the being the result of selfish manipulation. You know the idea that a villain is a hero in their own mind? Well, “Dear Evan Hanson” is entirely in Evan Hanson’s mind.

Honestly, the only salvation that could come from the movie is actually consequences to Evan. Like, he lies to a grieving family because he’s romantically attracted to the sister. That’s something the guy from You would do. And, after he confesses, she thanks him for it? If Evan faces any punishment in the movie it would be an improvement.

 

[shiekra38]

Like we’ve been saying: the music is so catchy and approachable the flaws in the story are easily missed. Literally, as I’m complaining about the damn show I’m listening to the soundtrack. And so much effort is put into establishing Evan as a awkward outsider the good that comes his way through the show comes across as finally deserved instead the being the result of selfish manipulation. You know the idea that a villain is a hero in their own mind? Well, “Dear Evan Hanson” is entirely in Evan Hanson’s mind.

Honestly, the only salvation that could come from the movie is actually consequences to Evan. Like, he lies to a grieving family because he’s romantically attracted to the sister. That’s something the guy from You would do. And, after he confesses, she thanks him for it? If Evan faces any punishment in the movie it would be an improvement.

Ok, update I like "For Forever"

But I am picturing a montage of Disney films on the castle with fireworks

 

[Nick]

The music is really, really, REALLY good and deeply emotionally affecting if you're in high school or early college (speaking from experience).

A sizeable contingent of people have an emotional attachment to the IP. And I stress again: the music is so, so good.

If only the music were applied to a more empowering plot...

 

[rageofthegods]

Oh for sure, I agree. Still though... it's a musical. Musicals have never been about the plot, it's about the emotion.

Wicked, on paper, has an awful, overbloated plot, but the music is so damn inspiring that you don't care.

You know a musical with a great plot and message? Legally Blonde. That's a Marc Platt musical production that needs a film adaptation.

 

[darkridelover]

I don't think all shows need or are required to have a good message. I don't think all main characters need to be heroic or right in their actions. The story is a strong story. It's not uplifting and no one did the right thing. But that doesn't make it bad or problematic. It's not a fairytale. Stop thinking shows should be.

Now as far as casting Ben Platt in the movie, not my favorite choice. But his dad is the executive producer.

 

[Legacy]

Ok, update I like "For Forever"

That’s the second song in the show that’s devoted to showing how lonely Evan is. And it’s the third song in the show.

If only the music were applied to a more empowering plot...

Oh for sure, I agree. Still though... it's a musical. Musicals have never been about the plot, it's about the emotion.

Wicked, on paper, has an awful, overbloated plot, but the music is so damn inspiring that you don't care.

You know a musical with a great plot and message? Legally Blonde. That's a Marc Platt musical production that needs a film adaptation.

Considering the source material for Wicked, the show is remarkably streamlined. I want to hate it more than I do.

But musical’s can absolutely tell complex, engaging stories with interesting characters. Legally Blonde and The Wedding Singer are arguably better than their source movies, with better developed characters. Then you have things like Next to Normal and Miss Saigon which are complex and complicated shows with layered, nuanced characters.

I just don’t want my shows to celebrate or justify swindlers.

 

[Nick]

I don't think all shows need or are required to have a good message. I don't think all main characters need to be heroic or right in their actions. The story is a strong story. It's not uplifting and no one did the right thing. But that doesn't make it bad or problematic. It's not a fairytale. Stop thinking shows should be.

Now as far as casting Ben Platt in the movie, not my favorite choice. But his dad is the executive producer.

No one is saying that all shows need to be that way. If Evan was the villain of this show, then that's cool, but is he the villain if he's CELEBRATED at the end? He doesn't face any realistic consequences for his actions. That's what we're talking about.

 

[shiekra38]

Ya'll didn't tell me he goes to work at Pottery Barn

My god, it's worse than I thought

 

[Clive]

That’s the second song in the show that’s devoted to showing how lonely Evan is. And it’s the third song in the show.

Considering the source material for Wicked, the show is remarkably streamlined. I want to hate it more than I do.

But musical’s can absolutely tell complex, engaging stories with interesting characters. Legally Blonde and The Wedding Singer are arguably better than their source movies, with better developed characters. Then you have things like Next to Normal and Miss Saigon which are complex and complicated shows with layered, nuanced characters.

I just don’t want my shows to celebrate or justify swindlers.

I like Wicked... both the book and the musical... even if the book is kind of a slog and way too self-serious... and the musical is so obsessed with calling attention to itself...

There's frankly been quite a few musical adaptations that are equal to if not better than their film counterparts in the last couple decades. Legally Blonde, in particular, stands out - rewatched the movie a few weeks ago and, as much as I love Reese in the role, was struck by how dated and thin at felt.

As far as swindlers go, I agree. Just like with any storytelling medium, perspective and intent matter. How do the storytellers want us to experience these characters? What are we meant to take away? In the case of Evan Hansen, they want us to empathize with the titular character and overlook his terrible actions, thereby avoiding any real moral introspection or real any depth beyond blunt emotion. What also bothers me, based on what I've heard about the show and what i'm reading, is it purports to be about something important without actually saying anything of substance - the music is just so good that you lean into it and, at least for a moment, accept that it must be true. Hansen functions as a way for young people to feel "seen" (arguably filling the generational role of RENT and Spring Awakening, I guess), so the ends in theory justify the means.

Something like The Music Man isn't asking us to do any serious moral interrogation and also isn't particularly pretentious about itself. It's a broad show that still understands that its conman is a conman and actions have consequences.

 

[Nick]

What also bothers me, based on what I've heard about the show and what i'm reading, is it purports to be about something important without actually saying anything of substance...

This right here.

Listening to the music, it's very positive and has a way of making people who maybe were bullied or something in high school feel a certain way. But that's the music. The problem is, the music doesn't match the script. If this had been a show about a young teen feeling lost in today's increasingly anti-social world (despite the fact that we are more connected than ever), then the music would've been a perfect fit. But instead, for some insane reason, they chose to go the route that they went.

Let's be honest, no one went to see this show because of the plot. They went to see it for Platt or because they had heard the soundtrack and loved it. But as has been said, the Soundtrack gives away almost no plot so why they went this way with the plot I just will never get. It was always going to be popular because Pasek & Paul are unquestionably great songwriters.

 

[rageofthegods]

I like Wicked... both the book and the musical... even if the book is kind of a slog and way too self-serious... and the musical is so obsessed with calling attention to itself...

There's frankly been quite a few musical adaptations that are equal to if not better than their film counterparts in the last couple decades. Legally Blonde, in particular, stands out - rewatched the movie a few weeks ago and, as much as I love Reese in the role, was struck by how dated and thin at felt.

Very true. I'd throw in Heathers and, dare I say it, Groundhog Day too.

I feel like I should try to explain why the musical felt so special because of the post earlier about why the response seems to be so positive. I absolutely think @Clive is right in that in retrospect, this show doesn't have much to say about popularity or depression or mental health, but it definitely felt like the first musical to tackle those issues. That's also how a generation that's too young to remember Bush v. Gore also fell in love with 13 Reasons Why. In retrospect, that show was terrible, but it was just the first to tackle issues in a way that was familiar and legible to those people. It also ties into what @Legacy mentioned about the musical being structured and the songs being written in such a way that you can't not identify with Evan, however ultimately scummy he is. Combine that with the fact that he's the same age as the theater kids first watching it and that there's almost literally nothing else on the market that speaks to those emotions, and you get yourself a recipe for powerful emotional identification even five years later. And I'm not ashamed to admit it, So Big/So Small still gets a tear out of me!

There will eventually be great art about the themes that Evan Hansen can only touch on, but that'll take time for the people who were the same age as Evan when it came out to grow up. But for now, DEH itself is a bit like Reality Bites or American Beauty, where it came out at exactly the right moment for a lot of people and is just inscrutable in hindsight.

 

[Nick]

Idk, I'm rambling! But I still think it's a bit like Reality Bites or American Beauty, where it came out at exactly the right moment for a lot of people and is just inscrutable in hindsight.

RENT is another things that sort of came out at exactly the right moment and despite how great the show is and how good the music is, it's negative depictions of HIV/AIDS have not aged well at all. However that was something that is easier to understand why the choices were made at the time. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when they were writing the script for Dear Evan Hanson.

 

[rageofthegods]

RENT is another things that sort of came out at exactly the right moment and despite how great the show is and how good the music is, it's negative depictions HIV/AIDS have not aged well at all. However that was something that is easier to understand why the choices were made at the time. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when they were writing the script for Dear Evan Hanson.

Oh God, Rent all the way. That show is straight-up embarrassing now.

 

[Legacy]

Hansen functions as a way for young people to feel "seen" (arguably filling the generational role of RENT and Spring Awakening, I guess), so the ends in theory justify the means.

Something like The Music Man isn't asking us to do any serious moral interrogation and also isn't particularly pretentious about itself. It's a broad show that still understands that its conman is a conman and actions have consequences.

Blehg. It sounds dirty to compare DEH to Rent and Spring Awakening. I get the argument that they’re the generational “visibility” shows, but Spring Awakening and Rent benefit from being ensembles railing against established systems with higher stakes. Rent touches on homosexuals and HIV/AIDS literally surviving against institutionalized stigmas. Spring Awakening is teens navigating puberty against religion. Evan Hansen is a guy railing against not having friends. And instead of genuinely banding together with others to realize they’re not alone, he lies to everyone and figures it out. Like, they’re all apples but one of them is wax.

And it’s not like a con man musical can’t work. Music Man, Catch Me If You Can, Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, The Producers are all great shows. But all of them suffer some sort of emotional and/or legal consequences.

 

[Nick]

More just generally related to the movie, supposedly Pasek & Paul wrote two new songs in the movie, one of which will be a duet with Platt and Amandla Stenberg (Alana). Obviously, they are doing this so that they can try to win an Academy Award for Best Original Song. I know In The Heights has a new song or two and West Side Story might have new music too, so it'll have competition.

And it’s not like a con man musical can’t work. Music Man, Catch Me If You Can, Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, The Producers are all great shows. But all of them suffer some sort of emotional and/or legal consequences.

Yeah, I have absolutely no problem with Evan being a con-man if that's what they wanted to go for. But the problem is when the con-man (villain) is celebrated, is he even a villain? That's where this show fails, is it tries to humanize Evan, make you feel bad for him and basically feel all of the feelings HE'S feeling (which is fine for us to feel what he's feeling, btw), but to then have the rest of the characters in the show overlook all the con-artistry he's been pulling off and be like "lol thanks for bringing our family together Evan, you're such a good person", that's where it loses me as an audience member.

The other characters in the show should feel normal human emotion. They shouldn't feel what EVAN is feeling and have it be some fairytale ending because that's not how it would ever work if someone did this.

 

[HalfGlass]

Not shooting down anyone’s criticisms as I can see the validity....but I have a lot of hardcore musical theater and casual performance watcher friends and every single one of them had nothing but the most positive things to say about this musical. I myself loved it too, as I felt it dealt with anxiety and depression in unique and interesting ways.

Don’t know how the movie will turn out, but I wouldn’t be surprised if this was a huge hit.

 

[Nick]

Not shooting down anyone’s criticisms as I can see the validity....but I have a lot of hardcore musical theater and casual performance watcher friends and every single one of them had nothing but the most positive things to say about this musical. I myself loved it too, as I felt it dealt with anxiety and depression in unique and interesting ways.

Don’t know how the movie will turn out, but I wouldn’t be surprised if this was a huge hit.

I have no doubt it will be a hit. I would wager almost (if not all of us) criticizing the musical will still wind up seeing it. But it has ALWAYS been a polarizing show, pretty much soon as the off-broadway version premiered.

 

[darkridelover]

More just generally related to the movie, supposedly Pasek & Paul wrote two new songs in the movie, one of which will be a duet with Platt and Amandla Stenberg (Alana). Obviously, they are doing this so that they can try to win an Academy Award for Best Original Song. I know In The Heights has a new song or two and West Side Story might have new music too, so it'll have competition.


Yeah, I have absolutely no problem with Evan being a con-man if that's what they wanted to go for. But the problem is when the con-man (villain) is celebrated, is he even a villain? That's where this show fails, is it tries to humanize Evan, make you feel bad for him and basically feel all of the feelings HE'S feeling (which is fine for us to feel what he's feeling, btw), but to then have the rest of the characters in the show overlook all the con-artistry he's been pulling off and be like "lol thanks for bringing our family together Evan, you're such a good person", that's where it loses me as an audience member.

The other characters in the show should feel normal human emotion. They shouldn't feel what EVAN is feeling and have it be some fairytale ending because that's not how it would ever work if someone did this.

I'm sorry, no one is celebrated in this show.

Spoiler: Evan loses....

Evan loses everything except his mom, who is the moral compass of the show. There is a resolve at the end of the show because theater shows generally work when there is a resolve. But it doesn't come across as anyone saying Evan is a good person. And he isn't the only one making terrible decisions in the show. Evan obviously being on the spectrum compounds the story and makes it rich and complex.

Evan at the end when he's told "Everyone needed it" he says, "THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT OK."

 

[Nick]

I'm sorry, no one is celebrated in this show. Evan loses everything except his mom, who is the moral compass of the show. There is a resolve at the end of the show because theater shows generally work when there is a resolve. But it doesn't come across as anyone saying Evan is a good person. And he isn't the only one making terrible decisions in the show. Evan obviously being on the spectrum compounds the story and makes it rich and complex.

I disagree and you will not change my opinion on that.

However, I DO think that Dear Evan Hansen is something that may actually translate to the screen better than the stage as the film version will be able to dive into the nuances a bit more. The show also feels like it was almost made to be a movie, so that helps.