Dear Evan Hansen

[shiekra38]

I’ve been through bad breakups, but never because the very foundation of the relationship is because I told them I was something that I wasn’t. I’ve never had an ex say, “Hey, remember how you said you were best friends with my dead brother when you barely knew each other and we had sex? Good times, friend.” So, no, it’s nothing like that.

Yeah but he has social anxiety

 

[Legacy]

Yeah but he has social anxiety

Which is the part that makes the whole thing feel even dirtier. It’s presented as a narrative cop-out which is lazy at best and intentional character armor at worst.

 

[shiekra38]

Which is the part that makes the whole thing feel even dirtier. It’s presented as a narrative cop-out which is lazy at best and intentional character armor at worst.

Yep using mental illness to cover lazy writing

 

[quinnmac000]

I think the biggest issue here is everyone is putting their own emotion in telling someone how they should respond to a situation and not realize that everyone reacts to the same thing in the same way. Legacy arguing that Zoe should respond a certain way because that's how he would do it but Zoe is a completely different person than him.

Also this is the age of Tiktok/influencers where everyone is manipulating everyone to believe they are a certain way etc. So a lot of younger people are going to relate to this story.

Yea what Evan did was gross. However, people have been manipulated for worst at the same time and received even less punishment.

 

[Allison]

I think the biggest issue here is everyone is putting their own emotion in telling someone how they should respond to a situation and not realize that everyone reacts to the same thing in the same way. Legacy arguing that Zoe should respond a certain way because that's how he would do it but Zoe is a completely different person than him.

Also this is the age of Tiktok/influencers where everyone is manipulating everyone to believe they are a certain way etc. So a lot of younger people are going to relate to this story.

Yea what Evan did was gross. However, people have been manipulated for worst at the same time and received even less punishment.

Not only is what this character did disgusting, it’s also illegal. If this wasn’t fiction he could literally do prison time for scamming people out of thousands. But instead, he gets not even a slap on the wrist and lives at home with mom and a job at Pottery Barn? It’s insulting at best.

 

[quinnmac000]

Not only is what this character did disgusting, it’s also illegal. If this wasn’t fiction he could literally do prison time for scamming people out of thousands. But instead, he gets not even a slap on the wrist and lives at home with mom and a job at Pottery Barn? It’s insulting at best.

Alana is the one most benefiting for the Connor Project not Evan and even after Evan admits its a lie, she went and defrauded people by posting Evan's letter. So, even if there was an investigation, she would be under the mircoscope more so than him.

Additionally, from an actual legal expert, charity fraud is actually really hard to prosecute. I mean just recently we found out a NY-based charity didn't even give money to charity and no one got prison time.

Why Taking Legal Action Against Charity Fraud Is So Hard

The recent 50-state case against four cancer groups was a milestone but highlighted the challenges facing state regulators.

www.philanthropy.com

 

[Clive]

Alana is the one most benefiting for the Connor Project not Evan and even after Evan admits its a lie, she went and defrauded people by posting Evan's letter. So, even if there was an investigation, she would be under the mircoscope more so than him.

Additionally, from an actual legal expert, charity fraud is actually really hard to prosecute. I mean just recently we found out a NY-based charity didn't even give money to charity and no one got prison time.

Why Taking Legal Action Against Charity Fraud Is So Hard

The recent 50-state case against four cancer groups was a milestone but highlighted the challenges facing state regulators.

www.philanthropy.com

I think we're more addressing the moral failing here, not the legal one.

 

[Allison]

Alana is the one most benefiting for the Connor Project not Evan and even after Evan admits its a lie, she went and defrauded people by posting Evan's letter. So, even if there was an investigation, she would be under the mircoscope more so than him.

Additionally, from an actual legal expert, charity fraud is actually really hard to prosecute. I mean just recently we found out a NY-based charity didn't even give money to charity and no one got prison time.

Why Taking Legal Action Against Charity Fraud Is So Hard

The recent 50-state case against four cancer groups was a milestone but highlighted the challenges facing state regulators.

www.philanthropy.com

What about these three??

Alleged ringleader of $400,000 GoFundMe scam hit with federal indictment

The heart-warming tale of a good Samaritan homeless vet fooled thousands.

www.google.com

IMO, this story is about a privileged kid who gets away with whatever he wants by using his mental illness as a shield. It’s 100% wrong any which way I look at it, and I’ve got a long history myself with mental illness, none of which give me carte blanche to deceive, manipulate and scam people. It’s yet another insulting display of people struggling with mental illness and I just can’t support it or sympathize with it, but, again, it’s IMO.

 

[Nick]

I think the biggest issue here is everyone is putting their own emotion in telling someone how they should respond to a situation and not realize that everyone reacts to the same thing in the same way. Legacy arguing that Zoe should respond a certain way because that's how he would do it but Zoe is a completely different person than him.

Also this is the age of Tiktok/influencers where everyone is manipulating everyone to believe they are a certain way etc. So a lot of younger people are going to relate to this story.

Yea what Evan did was gross. However, people have been manipulated for worst at the same time and received even less punishment.

It has nothing to do with how Zoe or any character should respond because that's how I personally would do it for me, for me, it's about natural human reaction. If someone finds out that someone says that that were good friends with someone who had just died, ends up dating his sister, and benefits greatly from lying over someone who killed themselves, once you tell the truth to such a long and drawn out and dirty lie, high schoolers don't respond kindly to BS like this.

 

[PerceptiveCoot]

I think the most pertinent take on the plot is that it seems generically twee.

 

[Legacy]

I think the biggest issue here is everyone is putting their own emotion in telling someone how they should respond to a situation and not realize that everyone reacts to the same thing in the same way. Legacy arguing that Zoe should respond a certain way because that's how he would do it but Zoe is a completely different person than him.

Also this is the age of Tiktok/influencers where everyone is manipulating everyone to believe they are a certain way etc. So a lot of younger people are going to relate to this story.

Yea what Evan did was gross. However, people have been manipulated for worst at the same time and received even less punishment.

Well, Zoe isn’t a person. She’s a fictional character in a show. So, it’s not how I would react compared to another person. It’s about an expectation for a realistic reaction. Because the show traffics in mental illness, depression, suicide and other “realisms,” the lack of realistic emotional responses from the victims is glaring. Because, realistically, the Murphys would be left in a far worse state than they were when Evan initially lied.

Think about it. The Murphys are desperate to understand why Conner killed himself, so they reach out to the only possible connection they have to that: Evan. Over several weeks, Evan fabricates entire aspects of Conner’s life and emotional state for the Murphys. What that means, again realistically, is that when he confesses to the Murphys the Murphys are realizing they know even less about their son then they thought they did. Realistically, it would break the family completely apart, even more so that they’re also keeping the lie a secret (most couples don’t survive the death of a child normally).

So when, a year later, Zoe meets him, it’s not realistic for the liar to be the voice of moral clarity to the victim. Especially when we haven’t seen any actual consequences outside of Papa Murphy turning his back on him. Evan’s lie bringing the family closer isn’t realistic. Telling her “it doesn’t make it right” isn’t his place in any context other than confession (which he’s already done). If this were a different story and Evan were painted as a villain, such actions could be perceived as an attempt at further manipulation.

Next to Normal is a show entirely about mental illness and depression that shows realistic consequences. Be More Chill is about an awkward teen who becomes something he’s not, abandoned his friend, and has full satisfying, believable redemption arc. So it’s not like DEH couldn’t have pulled it off. But it doesn’t even try. They want the accessible, inspirational “realism” of mental illness but no ramifications to character choice. Everything presented in the show is positioned to make Evan at once be the victim and relatable “hero” with none of his actual victims being given their moment to, rightly, tear the dude apart. I know his mom does, but that’s treating everything with kid gloves.

 

[Frogki]

Love the discussion here - I don't see anywhere else analyzing the script like this. The occasional critic has brought these issues up but the overwhelmingly positive public reception has really masked the major issues in the script, namely lack of consequences.

I think a lot of people read (as I think the writer and composers intended) Evan's lies as "one mistake spiraling out of control" rather than an intentional act of manipulation.
I know that's what I thought when I initially listened through the soundtrack. After hearing more about the plot over the years, it's left me agreeing with a few of the comments here - this feels like super lazy writing. There are so many avenues to explore here, there are so many other ways it could have been handled. Ironically the show has manipulated much of it's audience into being sympathetic to the point of ignoring the real harm of everyone outside of Evan. It's a very narrowly focused show.

Still love the soundtrack, still love the ideas behind some of the songs, hoping the comments by the writers that they added some consequences for Evan's actions hold up because it might actually benefit the story a fair bit, even if the overall plot is difficult to salvage as it is.

EDIT: I wanted to add that there are plays with characters who do bad things and get sympathy that do this better. Heathers is one, because there are some true consequences for the awful actions. It is also so stylized that it gets away with more - DEH is supposed to be "real" which means avoiding the issue of consequences really does feel like bad writing.

 

[quinnmac000]

Despite Dear Evan Hansen being problematic...the amount of people crying or holding back tears while watching the trailer bodes well. The Academy loves tearjerkers with social commentary.

 

[Jerroddragon]

To me it looks interesting

No idea if I'm in the mood for a movie like this right now...but one day

 

[Legacy]

Even when Platt is not singing, he seems on stage. His performance of youth is made up of practiced awkwardness. Every twitch and shrug looks rehearsed, as if Platt can’t shake the routine worn in from eight shows a week. Notably, he’s the only Broadway cast member that has been brought in for the movie. Sadly, amid a cast of much stronger screen actors, he is not a strength but a relic.

Dear Evan Hansen Review - IGN

Based on the hit Broadway musical, Dear Evan Hansen offers a moving but jarringly miscast musical about community and mental illness.

www.ign.com

After 12 reviews, its Metacritic score is at 41.

Don’t think it’ll be the awards darling people expected.

 

[Grabnar]

Dear Evan Hansen Review - IGN

Based on the hit Broadway musical, Dear Evan Hansen offers a moving but jarringly miscast musical about community and mental illness.

www.ign.com

After 12 reviews, its Metacritic score is at 41.

Don’t think it’ll be the awards darling people expected.

The reviews from this have been *chef's kiss*

In 2009, Warner Bros. released Orphan, a horror movie about a young child who worms her way into a normal American household using perverse psychological manipulation before (spoiler alert) being revealed as an adult woman. On Thursday night, the audience at the opening night of the 2021 Toronto International Film Festival was lucky enough to be treated to an unofficial Orphan remake. It is called Dear Evan Hansen, and it is nominally the story of a high schooler who tells a white lie that spirals out of control. But based on what’s staring us in the face from the movie’s very first frames, it is hard to read that plot as anything other than a grown man’s elaborate scheme to distract a bunch of teenagers from the fact that he is actually twice as old as they are. And even more chillingly, he gets away with it!
(...)
*This article originally claimed that Ben Platt’s Dear Evan Hansen haircut was a wig. It is, astoundingly, his own hair.

But the team behind Dear Evan Hansen put Platt in prosthetics and opaque, pasty makeup, along with a curly mop of hair, that strands the actor firmly in the uncanny valley. But the attempt to make Platt seem younger somehow renders him both older and inhuman – an act of near-sabotage so distracting it basically renders the movie unrecoverable.

For instance, a song wherein Evan Hansen and an imaginary version of the dead Connor sing a jolly duet could work in a medium where artifice is high, but in a film photographed at a bland, beige high school, the sequence borders on tasteless.

 

[Nick]

Dear Evan Hansen Review - IGN

Based on the hit Broadway musical, Dear Evan Hansen offers a moving but jarringly miscast musical about community and mental illness.

www.ign.com

After 12 reviews, its Metacritic score is at 41.

Don’t think it’ll be the awards darling people expected.

I think West Side Story will end up being the musical darling, but I wouldn’t be surprised if In The Heights got a theatrical re-release to push it during awards season.

 

[ThemeParks4Life]

This is tracking low; Box Office Pro had its opening weekend at 6-15M last week. The lower end would be disastrous.

I think West Side Story will end up being the musical darling, but I wouldn’t be surprised if In The Heights got a theatrical re-release to push it during awards season.

tbh, I don't think any musicals are getting into Picture this year unless WSS is out of this world amazing. WB is too focused on Dune and King Richard to push ITH.

 

[Nick]

This is tracking low; Box Office Pro had its opening weekend at 6-15M last week. The lower end would be disastrous.


tbh, I don't think any musicals are getting into Picture this year unless WSS is out of this world amazing. WB is too focused on Dune and King Richard to push ITH.

No, I don’t either, but even if we are, we’re talking Best Musical/Comedy at the Globes at best.

Disney/Fox also have quite a bit more on their plate to be pushing for awards beyond WSS (The Last Duel, The Eyes of Tammy Faye, The French Dispatch, Nightmare Alley)

Obviously not all of those movies can be pushed for BP, but we’ll see a lot of Best Actor, Actress, and Supporting roles be pushed for noms from those films.

 

[HalfGlass]

I loved the play - I love the movie. Sorry, not sorry. :clap: