Old Vs New HHN

[Darko]

So I have no idea how best to narrow this down.

Basically what I want to know is that what do you think old HHN (we’ll narrow it to 2000-2011?) did better, Vs what you think modern HHN (2012-now?) does better.

This is something I’ve been interested in for quite some time now given that I know several friends who are older than me who attended HHN in the 90s, didn’t seem to care much for 2000s HHN as much, and seem to be enjoying it more the way it is now. Whereas other friends I know seem to prefer the Icon years if you will.

So I guess I wanna know what y’all think about I guess “old” HHN Vs “new” or modern HHN?

Houses, Scare zones, Shows, atmosphere, etc.

 

[OhHaiInternet95]

I feel like the first "era" of HHN was 1991-2001. Yeah I know Jack first appeared in 2000 but 2000-1 seemed way more similar to the 90s than to 2002. So I would consider Islands of Fear to be the start of the event's "golden age," and then obviously 2012 to be the start of the modern era.

 

[Darko]

I feel like the first "era" of HHN was 1991-2001. Yeah I know Jack first appeared in 2000 but 2000-1 seemed way more similar to the 90s than to 2002. So I would consider Islands of Fear to be the start of the event's "golden age," and then obviously 2012 to be the start of the modern era.

As I said, I tried narrowing it down. HHN has quite a few “eras”. I was mainly narrowing it from the Icon years and from 2012 to now.

 

[MrRoamer]

The biggest difference between old HHN and modern HHN for me has to be the boxing in of scare zones. I personally loved when it there was always a chance a scareactor was behind every tree, in the shadows, or laying down in some hedges trying to get the scare. The scare zones were just extra spooky parts of the streets that sometimes had cool extra scares, sometimes it was just a pile of junk in the way to make you feel uneasy.

You always felt on edge to a degree and that feeling made you more susceptible to the scares in the houses. Some of my favorite scares which I'm sure I've said multiple times weren't in scarezones or anything special.

My first trip we were walking down one of the streets and it was just dark, dark and foggy. We saw a group of 3 girls walking towards us in the distance and then behind them we saw a chainsaw scareactor pop out of nowhere. They had no idea and he creeped up on them, got right behind them, and BRHRHRHRHRRRrrrrr. The girls all jumped and started running around like a Scooby Doo episode running into each other until they realized there was a bathroom that they ran into.

My other favorite has to be the Rock Wall. He was just over there chilling at the transition from JP to Lost Continent. Somone starts asking for help and a bush starts moving on top of the rock wall and BAM! Whole wall comin at you

 

[shiekra38]

Really it comes down to a few key components, and perhaps we could also use the comparison of 90’s Universal to now to aid in our analysis.

When HHN was introduced, the intention was to create an after hours event that helped bump attendance during the more classic “slow” seasons. It was “Florida’s Biggest Halloween Party” and had that environment and intention.

The original years very much had a “Universal Studios after dark” type feel. It felt like a darker extension of the day product in a lot of ways. Yet, it still had echoes of home grown horror event. It felt more haphazard back in the day for sure…because it was. More on that in a bit.

After the events of 2001, a drop in tourism, a disappointing launch of IOA, a buyout, etc. Universal was very much experiencing “death by a thousand small cuts”.

The event moved to IOA to promote the new park, and during those years leading up to about 2009-ish. The event became less of a “bump” in attendance, and more of a necessity to keep the parks in the black during the off season. Lucky for us, it did just that (and more)

However, you can track in real time the seeds being planted for modern HHN by way of some mandated IP integration in otherwise imaginative and creative years. There was clearly some primitive synergy attempts, yes, even in the much beloved Icon era. It was largely ignored though due to the focus being on the more original aspects of the event.

It’s hard to imagine now, but Universal back then couldn’t get IPs in the same way as now, even if they wanted to. The icons were really a creation of in-house IP to market the event. They were thinly veiled amalgamations of previous horror movie characters that could be splashed everywhere at a very low cost and gain popularity over the course of the event.

Let’s also track what was going on with the event from a design perspective. The houses went from banging on trash cans and slamming down drop doors to using higher tech theatrical effects. It was a slow process, but by the end of the icon era, the event had transformed the way it scares people.

Side note: I do think it’s funny when people want a classic house recreated as it was back in the day. I think if this were to happen, the culture shock would be hilariously rich to see.

Anywho,

Then came Potter, Comcast, and….get your tomatoes ready….The Walking Dead

Somewhere in 2009 - 2011ish…the event was seriously evaluated and the icon era we know now was born…I’m sure someone else can speak to the details of what happened here. But from what I understand, it was a combo of new leadership, some firing(s), the Potter effect, and a more aligned corporate structure that didn’t exist before.

Side note (again, sorry): Universal as a “thing” is much more aligned than it was back in the day. Where as previous owners viewed the parks more as an extra stream of revenue (and perhaps nuisances), Comcast views them as an important part of their synergistic strategy. And to be totally honest, thank goodness. However, HHN no longer falls into a “do your own thing” type of realm…it is a deeply integrated part of this newly aligned company. Add in the fact that throughout all the things we talked about above, HHN was increasing more and more in attendance each year (so much so that IOA physically couldn’t handle the event).

IP integration just elevated the event to a new height of popularity, revenue, and overall status. The same could be said for Universal’s day parks. Some people pine for the days of the behind-the-scenes and ride the movies type environments rather than the parks we have today…and yet..Universal is currently being considered a real threat to the impenetrable Disney. Something that would have been a joke back in the day. Things are very very different now.

So what changed?

Largely, and to toss out a possibly reductive analysis….Crowds

 

[shiekra38]

(Cont. sorry hit my word limit)
Crowds:
Back in 2001 when I started going (much to my ignorance)...the event was not attended in the same way it is now. Sure it was well attended, of course, it wouldn’t have continued if it wasn’t, but it was nowhere near what it is now. They weren’t lying when they said “we are using every single inch of Studios for the event this year”. That’s not some creative decision, that’s a necessary ops decision. I mean, the day product doesn’t even do that.

Crowds are a big discussion in the various Disney and Universal discussions right now. They have their pluses and minuses. When Thanos discussed the universe being “perfectly balanced” I believe he was talking about theme park crowds.

A park that is under crowded feels dead, a park that is overcrowded feels uncomfortable.

I think back in the 90s HHN fell into that just right category and this continued for a while. However, an under crowded horror event can get away with that feeling a lot better than the day product can. If you went to HHN on a dead night back in the day it was a truly frightening and intimate horror experience that is just not possible anymore. Perhaps the day after the hurricane would be about as close as you could get (ironically happening this year).

What was possible with smaller crowds (pulsing, empty walkways allowing scareactors to ambush you, not seeing a scareactor reset in front of you) is just not possible anymore. For some, these are necessary things for them to have a good evening at a horror event, I get it.

But I can’t complain about Universal being successful. It’s what we want, truthfully.

Side note (last one I promise): There were some scary times in Universal’s history where we weren’t sure how the parks were going to move forward. 2008/09 were particularly bad years. 2020 was also one in recent memories. So trust me, you want crowds, you want high attendance. You want a busy HHN.

In conclusion, the event is popular, and with that popularity comes some things that must change along with it. Which leads me to my next “thing that changed”.

Scare Tactics:
As I turned the corner in the Run house, winding through a maze of chainlink fence and corrugated metal, I thought I was alone in the scene. I saw some people ahead of me, and being clever I thought I would keep my eyes on them to see where the next scare was coming from. What I didn’t realize is there was an opening right next to me with a scareactor ready to run a pipe across the piece of corrugated metal that hid him. As he brushed against it and toward me, I yelped and flung myself against some chain link fence…luckily it held me…The scareactor proceed to follow me through two more scenes before heading back to his spot to traumatize another youngling

Well joke’s on him, I had a blast and went right back through

As I came back around to his spot I heard a “I thought I got rid of you boy”...but…he wasn’t in his spot. Where was he?? Oh…on the ground crouched down and ready to pounce. As he did and I ran a good distance without running into a single person I was then bombarded by a chainsaw wielding maniac I had forgotten about. He went for my feet and I jumped so high I felt like I almost hit the top of the Earthquake queue building roof.

I went through the house eight more times that night…and some of the fondest memories I have at a horror event happened that night. The scareactors taunting me and remembering what I looked like. The simple, yet effective chain link labyrinth…The house felt out of control, every time was different, and I would never experience anything like it again.

I tell this story because this is what HHN was for a long time. This kind of thing was possible on certain nights and the tactics were very very different back in the day. Remember before when I discussed the haphazard nature of the event? That’s all summed up in my experience in Run. Juxtapose that to when I went through another version of Run in 2006 (you can imagine my excitement) and I was met with detailed sets, timed triggers, and a conga line that inched forward allowing us to see the same scare happen at least three times due to some overzealous actors that got a little trigger happy (or pedal, rather)....you can imagine my disappointment.

The event used to be primitive in its scare tactics. Using power tools, smacking hands again the wall, hitting things to make noise. That was how they used to get you. Sure they had triggers, but they weren’t the emphasis.

Fast forward to today, and the event is a highly detailed, highly programmed, highly time sensitive event. You could, in theory, pass through a house and miss the majority of scenes because you caught a cast change or just missed the “reset”. This used to not be possible back in the day. Scareactors would go after you regardless and if they were changing casts, sometimes you would get two coming at you where there was only one previously.

The event really isn’t concerned with scaring every single person like they used to be, rather, they are concerned with consistency of show. This is not a knock on anyone, it’s just a different philosophy.

I will be the first to tell you, when modern HHN fires on all cylinders, they snap harder than back in the day. Seeds, Scarecrow, Graveyard, etc hit harder than any of the classics. Buuut sometimes those type of experiences can feel rare.

Specifically this year it seemed like they hit a new height of trying to create an experience and not necessarily “scare” you.

In summary, HHN has moved away from the practical and more towards the programmed. I think that may be why Descendants was my favorite this year. It had the DNA of an old school HHN house. Practical scares, gritty, dark, with some nice sets. Yet, still aggressive when it wants to be. Crowds do help to cut down aggression a bit. It’s hard to get in someone’s face when that someone is being pushed through so quickly and when you are told to stay on your mark and no deviation from said mark. I mean, scareactors always had boo holes at HHN, but sometimes back in the day they felt like more “suggestions” than anything else lol.

Which leads me to the last change

Consistency and Capacity:
I heard it said by a haunt creator that the best way to scare someone is to break your own rules. HHN feels like it has backed itself into the proverbial corner in this aspect. It’s highly polished, highly attended, and highly consistent.

So much so that when they announce an IP these days you kind of already know what it’s going to sound like, look like, how they’re going to do the scares.

Yes, HHN is highly predictable

This is typically not something you want a horror event to be. There are exceptions of course, often yearly, but for the most part we know where the scares are coming from. We know how they do them. We know in a big room that there is a pedal and a strobe light waiting to go off…sometimes we’ve already seen it happen before we got in the room…We just know.

I’m not sure what the solution is here, but HHN used to be a bit unpredictable in its execution.

Imagine as a kid turning the corner and seeing Toon Lagoon covered in soap, and then creepy characters come jumping out. Unexpected to say the least. This would never be possible today.

To some degree I feel like I’ve experienced the same event for the last 5 years (oh yes, whatever is going on is a new phenomenon, whatever “it” is). It feels very plug and play at this point. Part of that again is because of how big the event is. It’s hard to change things up and surprise people when you’re strapped for space and every inch of the park needs to be used for foot traffic. It’s hard to be creative when you don’t have room.

The surprises back in the day are also a product of an event learning what worked and what didn’t. Today, they know, down to a T…and yet, it feels like they know a little too well. To the point that it’s a little unsurprising.

So, I think the answer to your question lies within your question. What is the difference between Old and New HHN? Well, one was an ever changing event that was morphing and growing through corporate turmoil and a resort finding its footing…The event now is a well established brand in a resort that’s healthier than its ever been.

Personally I will take a more healthy resort, a full event, and a bend towards more “by the numbers” than the way things were…Although the way things were are lasting memories that I look on fondly.

 

[Darko]

Wow this is much more extensive of a reply than I thought. I love it. Thank you.

And yeah, I feel you on this. I don’t remember the programmed feel being this bad since even 25.

Also you made me realize what it is about Descendants and Chupacabras I loved so much this year and why they were my favorites. Outside of the Chups taking a bit too long to reset sometimes (though both times I hit them all) a good bit of the scares actually didn’t seem to have triggers. A lot of Scareactors just seemed to pop up with no effects or sound sometimes. I’ve now gotten so use to the way scares are presented now that it kind of through me for a loop and got me both times.

Honestly I felt like this year some houses (mostly Descendants honestly) felt a little more like the actors had a bit of flexibility. And with Descendants getting a lot of love this year and especially being considered to be the scariest house of the year it seems, I wonder if they may experiment again with scares.

Obviously, like you said, with crowds and the popularity of the event, it’s never going to go back the way it was. Honestly I can go to Howl-O-Scream if I want to experience HHN from the old days (and I love Howl-O-Scream).

I guess while people didn’t seem to fully agree on this year, I think the level of experimentation in especially Descendants gives me the smallest degree of hope for the future of the houses. The scare zones gave me hope for their future. Descendants and Chupacabras felt just a tad more raw and nasty and gritty compared to the others and they both seem to get a strong reaction.

I’ll be curious for this events future. I definitely agree that when the houses hit, they hid hard. I’m just hoping they hit more like Descendants did in the future.

I’m obviously not asking for old HHN to return, I go to HHN for the polish (most others haunts lack polish so there’s no shortage of those) but I do want some grit back. The few houses that have it are standouts.

 

[shiekra38]

Wow this is much more extensive of a reply than I thought. I love it. Thank you.

And yeah, I feel you on this. I don’t remember the programmed feel being this bad since even 25.

Also you made me realize what it is about Descendants and Chupacabras I loved so much this year and why they were my favorites. Outside of the Chups taking a bit too long to reset sometimes (though both times I hit them all) a good bit of the scares actually didn’t seem to have triggers. A lot of Scareactors just seemed to pop up with no effects or sound sometimes. I’ve now gotten so use to the way scares are presented now that it kind of through me for a loop and got me both times.

Honestly I felt like this year some houses (mostly Descendants honestly) felt a little more like the actors had a bit of flexibility. And with Descendants getting a lot of love this year and especially being considered to be the scariest house of the year it seems, I wonder if they may experiment again with scares.

Obviously, like you said, with crowds and the popularity of the event, it’s never going to go back the way it was. Honestly I can go to Howl-O-Scream if I want to experience HHN from the old days (and I love Howl-O-Scream).

I guess while people didn’t seem to fully agree on this year, I think the level of experimentation in especially Descendants gives me the smallest degree of hope for the future of the houses. The scare zones gave me hope for their future. Descendants and Chupacabras felt just a tad more raw and nasty and gritty compared to the others and they both seem to get a strong reaction.

I’ll be curious for this events future. I definitely agree that when the houses hit, they hid hard. I’m just hoping they hit more like Descendants did in the future.

I’m obviously not asking for old HHN to return, I go to HHN for the polish (most others haunts lack polish so there’s no shortage of those) but I do want some grit back. The few houses that have it are standouts.

I was already kind of working on a video about it so I just stole some pieces of my script haha...

But it's certainly something I've been thinking about and I agree, I'm curious again for what's next

If history has shown us anything, it's that the event will keep changing

 

[Darko]

I was already kind of working on a video about it so I just stole some pieces of my script haha...

But it's certainly something I've been thinking about and I agree, I'm curious again for what's next

If history has shown us anything, it's that the event will keep changing

Yeah, there is no telling where this event will go next year.

HHN is easily one of the most (if not the most) ever changing and evolving haunt. The 90s HHN is not the same as 2000’s HHN and 2000’s HHN is not the same as 2010’s HHN. Honestly 2020’s HHN seems like it might be getting a bit of an evolution itself from 2010’s. Now how far it goes is anyone’s guess.

I’m not expecting icons or anything, but a new focus on original content in park seems possible after this year (and even last year for that matter). I have hope.

That being said, Eddie does need to get his year as icon at least once dammit.

 

[Lucky Planet]

(Cont. sorry hit my word limit)
Crowds:
Back in 2001 when I started going (much to my ignorance)...the event was not attended in the same way it is now. Sure it was well attended, of course, it wouldn’t have continued if it wasn’t, but it was nowhere near what it is now. They weren’t lying when they said “we are using every single inch of Studios for the event this year”. That’s not some creative decision, that’s a necessary ops decision. I mean, the day product doesn’t even do that.

Crowds are a big discussion in the various Disney and Universal discussions right now. They have their pluses and minuses. When Thanos discussed the universe being “perfectly balanced” I believe he was talking about theme park crowds.

A park that is under crowded feels dead, a park that is overcrowded feels uncomfortable.

I think back in the 90s HHN fell into that just right category and this continued for a while. However, an under crowded horror event can get away with that feeling a lot better than the day product can. If you went to HHN on a dead night back in the day it was a truly frightening and intimate horror experience that is just not possible anymore. Perhaps the day after the hurricane would be about as close as you could get (ironically happening this year).

What was possible with smaller crowds (pulsing, empty walkways allowing scareactors to ambush you, not seeing a scareactor reset in front of you) is just not possible anymore. For some, these are necessary things for them to have a good evening at a horror event, I get it.

But I can’t complain about Universal being successful. It’s what we want, truthfully.

Side note (last one I promise): There were some scary times in Universal’s history where we weren’t sure how the parks were going to move forward. 2008/09 were particularly bad years. 2020 was also one in recent memories. So trust me, you want crowds, you want high attendance. You want a busy HHN.

In conclusion, the event is popular, and with that popularity comes some things that must change along with it. Which leads me to my next “thing that changed”.

Scare Tactics:
As I turned the corner in the Run house, winding through a maze of chainlink fence and corrugated metal, I thought I was alone in the scene. I saw some people ahead of me, and being clever I thought I would keep my eyes on them to see where the next scare was coming from. What I didn’t realize is there was an opening right next to me with a scareactor ready to run a pipe across the piece of corrugated metal that hid him. As he brushed against it and toward me, I yelped and flung myself against some chain link fence…luckily it held me…The scareactor proceed to follow me through two more scenes before heading back to his spot to traumatize another youngling

Well joke’s on him, I had a blast and went right back through

As I came back around to his spot I heard a “I thought I got rid of you boy”...but…he wasn’t in his spot. Where was he?? Oh…on the ground crouched down and ready to pounce. As he did and I ran a good distance without running into a single person I was then bombarded by a chainsaw wielding maniac I had forgotten about. He went for my feet and I jumped so high I felt like I almost hit the top of the Earthquake queue building roof.

I went through the house eight more times that night…and some of the fondest memories I have at a horror event happened that night. The scareactors taunting me and remembering what I looked like. The simple, yet effective chain link labyrinth…The house felt out of control, every time was different, and I would never experience anything like it again.

I tell this story because this is what HHN was for a long time. This kind of thing was possible on certain nights and the tactics were very very different back in the day. Remember before when I discussed the haphazard nature of the event? That’s all summed up in my experience in Run. Juxtapose that to when I went through another version of Run in 2006 (you can imagine my excitement) and I was met with detailed sets, timed triggers, and a conga line that inched forward allowing us to see the same scare happen at least three times due to some overzealous actors that got a little trigger happy (or pedal, rather)....you can imagine my disappointment.

The event used to be primitive in its scare tactics. Using power tools, smacking hands again the wall, hitting things to make noise. That was how they used to get you. Sure they had triggers, but they weren’t the emphasis.

Fast forward to today, and the event is a highly detailed, highly programmed, highly time sensitive event. You could, in theory, pass through a house and miss the majority of scenes because you caught a cast change or just missed the “reset”. This used to not be possible back in the day. Scareactors would go after you regardless and if they were changing casts, sometimes you would get two coming at you where there was only one previously.

The event really isn’t concerned with scaring every single person like they used to be, rather, they are concerned with consistency of show. This is not a knock on anyone, it’s just a different philosophy.

I will be the first to tell you, when modern HHN fires on all cylinders, they snap harder than back in the day. Seeds, Scarecrow, Graveyard, etc hit harder than any of the classics. Buuut sometimes those type of experiences can feel rare.

Specifically this year it seemed like they hit a new height of trying to create an experience and not necessarily “scare” you.

In summary, HHN has moved away from the practical and more towards the programmed. I think that may be why Descendants was my favorite this year. It had the DNA of an old school HHN house. Practical scares, gritty, dark, with some nice sets. Yet, still aggressive when it wants to be. Crowds do help to cut down aggression a bit. It’s hard to get in someone’s face when that someone is being pushed through so quickly and when you are told to stay on your mark and no deviation from said mark. I mean, scareactors always had boo holes at HHN, but sometimes back in the day they felt like more “suggestions” than anything else lol.

Which leads me to the last change

Consistency and Capacity:
I heard it said by a haunt creator that the best way to scare someone is to break your own rules. HHN feels like it has backed itself into the proverbial corner in this aspect. It’s highly polished, highly attended, and highly consistent.

So much so that when they announce an IP these days you kind of already know what it’s going to sound like, look like, how they’re going to do the scares.

Yes, HHN is highly predictable

Wow this is much more extensive of a reply than I thought. I love it. Thank you.

And yeah, I feel you on this. I don’t remember the programmed feel being this bad since even 25.

Also you made me realize what it is about Descendants and Chupacabras I loved so much this year and why they were my favorites. Outside of the Chups taking a bit too long to reset sometimes (though both times I hit them all) a good bit of the scares actually didn’t seem to have triggers. A lot of Scareactors just seemed to pop up with no effects or sound sometimes. I’ve now gotten so use to the way scares are presented now that it kind of through me for a loop and got me both times.

Honestly I felt like this year some houses (mostly Descendants honestly) felt a little more like the actors had a bit of flexibility. And with Descendants getting a lot of love this year and especially being considered to be the scariest house of the year it seems, I wonder if they may experiment again with scares.

Obviously, like you said, with crowds and the popularity of the event, it’s never going to go back the way it was. Honestly I can go to Howl-O-Scream if I want to experience HHN from the old days (and I love Howl-O-Scream).

I guess while people didn’t seem to fully agree on this year, I think the level of experimentation in especially Descendants gives me the smallest degree of hope for the future of the houses. The scare zones gave me hope for their future. Descendants and Chupacabras felt just a tad more raw and nasty and gritty compared to the others and they both seem to get a strong reaction.

I’ll be curious for this events future. I definitely agree that when the houses hit, they hid hard. I’m just hoping they hit more like Descendants did in the future.

I’m obviously not asking for old HHN to return, I go to HHN for the polish (most others haunts lack polish so there’s no shortage of those) but I do want some grit back. The few houses that have it are standouts.

that is why hellblock horror might be my favorite house this year. because it really feels like a time machine to 2006.
hellblock horror is what going back in time will feel like. the chain link fence, the concrete walls, the complete lack of animatronics and any big special effects.
only relying on the actors alone. the loud sirens, the chaos, the security guards yelling. the simple suits and masks
this is the closest to an old school house we will ever get...

i love hellblock much more than coven and chupacabra in that sense ( although fiesta de chupacabra feels old school too)

 

[shiekra38]

that is why hellblock horror might be my favorite house this year. because it really feels like a time machine to 2006.
hellblock horror is what going back in time will feel like. the chain link fence, the concrete walls, the complete lack of animatronics and any big special effects.
only relying on the actors alone. the loud sirens, the chaos, the security guards yelling. the simple suits and masks
this is the closest to an old school house we will ever get...

i love hellblock much more than coven and chupacabra in that sense ( although fiesta de chupacabra feels old school too)

Ironic as Hellblock was the last minute Nancy of this year

I could definitely squint and see what you're talking about though

Yet, I did feel a little cheated as Cabin is one of my favorite horror(?) films

And they did the "monsters get loose in facility" thing much better before

 

[Lucky Planet]

And they did the "monsters get loose in facility" thing much better before

which one?

 

[shiekra38]

which one?

Cabin in The Woods, HHN23

 

[Lucky Planet]

Cabin in The Woods, HHN23

ok I thought you meant another one.
I know Cabin in the woods is very beloved, i know the movie was excellent, (I personally did that house 3 times only I think, lines were horrible long)
I honestly mostly only remember the first half in the cabin which was extremely well made and detailed.
but, looking at the video for this house now, the monster part does not look that different from hellblock horror, im looking at the sets in the video and it looks almost the same. (hellblock horror feels like a longer version of the monster part in cabin the woods house)
I know the characters in cabin in the woods are much more better than the creatures in hellblock, but honestly. watching this vid, they feel almost the same

im not saying that cabin in the woods wasnt high quality, and the cabin part was great. i also know that everyone hates hellblock.
but the last part of cabin almost feels the same as hellblock

 

[Darko]

As someone who missed 20-24 I never did Cabin (would have loved to as I love that film to death) so Hellblock Horror did it for me.

Hellblock definitely felt haphazard (because it kinda was) and honestly was what I loved about it. Sorta had a grittiness to it. I kinda want more houses like it, Chupacabras, and Descendants in the future. They have a nasty feel to them. Honestly why TCM from 26 is an all-timer for me. That and I loved when houses sometimes weren’t over when you got outside. They haven’t done that in so long.

 

[Lucky Planet]

As someone who missed 20-24 I never did Cabin (would have loved to as I love that film to death) so Hellblock Horror did it for me.

Hellblock definitely felt haphazard (because it kinda was) and honestly was what I loved about it. Sorta had a grittiness to it. I kinda want more houses like it, Chupacabras, and Descendants in the future. They have a nasty feel to them. Honestly why TCM from 26 is an all-timer for me. That and I loved when houses sometimes weren’t over when you got outside. They haven’t done that in so long.

Yeah. My point was just that people are hating on hellblock but that's how old school houses felt back then. Houses like Doomsday in 2008 or run in 2006, giggles and gore,
The only bad thing I can see about hellblock is that painting all the masks white kinda ruined the variety in the house ( variety that cabin had)
They should have not made all the hellblock masks look white like that.

 

[MrRoamer]

(Cont. sorry hit my word limit)
Crowds:
Back in 2001 when I started going (much to my ignorance)...the event was not attended in the same way it is now. Sure it was well attended, of course, it wouldn’t have continued if it wasn’t, but it was nowhere near what it is now. They weren’t lying when they said “we are using every single inch of Studios for the event this year”. That’s not some creative decision, that’s a necessary ops decision. I mean, the day product doesn’t even do that.

Crowds are a big discussion in the various Disney and Universal discussions right now. They have their pluses and minuses. When Thanos discussed the universe being “perfectly balanced” I believe he was talking about theme park crowds.

A park that is under crowded feels dead, a park that is overcrowded feels uncomfortable.

I think back in the 90s HHN fell into that just right category and this continued for a while. However, an under crowded horror event can get away with that feeling a lot better than the day product can. If you went to HHN on a dead night back in the day it was a truly frightening and intimate horror experience that is just not possible anymore. Perhaps the day after the hurricane would be about as close as you could get (ironically happening this year).

What was possible with smaller crowds (pulsing, empty walkways allowing scareactors to ambush you, not seeing a scareactor reset in front of you) is just not possible anymore. For some, these are necessary things for them to have a good evening at a horror event, I get it.

But I can’t complain about Universal being successful. It’s what we want, truthfully.

Side note (last one I promise): There were some scary times in Universal’s history where we weren’t sure how the parks were going to move forward. 2008/09 were particularly bad years. 2020 was also one in recent memories. So trust me, you want crowds, you want high attendance. You want a busy HHN.

In conclusion, the event is popular, and with that popularity comes some things that must change along with it. Which leads me to my next “thing that changed”.

Scare Tactics:
As I turned the corner in the Run house, winding through a maze of chainlink fence and corrugated metal, I thought I was alone in the scene. I saw some people ahead of me, and being clever I thought I would keep my eyes on them to see where the next scare was coming from. What I didn’t realize is there was an opening right next to me with a scareactor ready to run a pipe across the piece of corrugated metal that hid him. As he brushed against it and toward me, I yelped and flung myself against some chain link fence…luckily it held me…The scareactor proceed to follow me through two more scenes before heading back to his spot to traumatize another youngling

Well joke’s on him, I had a blast and went right back through

As I came back around to his spot I heard a “I thought I got rid of you boy”...but…he wasn’t in his spot. Where was he?? Oh…on the ground crouched down and ready to pounce. As he did and I ran a good distance without running into a single person I was then bombarded by a chainsaw wielding maniac I had forgotten about. He went for my feet and I jumped so high I felt like I almost hit the top of the Earthquake queue building roof.

I went through the house eight more times that night…and some of the fondest memories I have at a horror event happened that night. The scareactors taunting me and remembering what I looked like. The simple, yet effective chain link labyrinth…The house felt out of control, every time was different, and I would never experience anything like it again.

I tell this story because this is what HHN was for a long time. This kind of thing was possible on certain nights and the tactics were very very different back in the day. Remember before when I discussed the haphazard nature of the event? That’s all summed up in my experience in Run. Juxtapose that to when I went through another version of Run in 2006 (you can imagine my excitement) and I was met with detailed sets, timed triggers, and a conga line that inched forward allowing us to see the same scare happen at least three times due to some overzealous actors that got a little trigger happy (or pedal, rather)....you can imagine my disappointment.

The event used to be primitive in its scare tactics. Using power tools, smacking hands again the wall, hitting things to make noise. That was how they used to get you. Sure they had triggers, but they weren’t the emphasis.

Fast forward to today, and the event is a highly detailed, highly programmed, highly time sensitive event. You could, in theory, pass through a house and miss the majority of scenes because you caught a cast change or just missed the “reset”. This used to not be possible back in the day. Scareactors would go after you regardless and if they were changing casts, sometimes you would get two coming at you where there was only one previously.

The event really isn’t concerned with scaring every single person like they used to be, rather, they are concerned with consistency of show. This is not a knock on anyone, it’s just a different philosophy.

I will be the first to tell you, when modern HHN fires on all cylinders, they snap harder than back in the day. Seeds, Scarecrow, Graveyard, etc hit harder than any of the classics. Buuut sometimes those type of experiences can feel rare.

Specifically this year it seemed like they hit a new height of trying to create an experience and not necessarily “scare” you.

In summary, HHN has moved away from the practical and more towards the programmed. I think that may be why Descendants was my favorite this year. It had the DNA of an old school HHN house. Practical scares, gritty, dark, with some nice sets. Yet, still aggressive when it wants to be. Crowds do help to cut down aggression a bit. It’s hard to get in someone’s face when that someone is being pushed through so quickly and when you are told to stay on your mark and no deviation from said mark. I mean, scareactors always had boo holes at HHN, but sometimes back in the day they felt like more “suggestions” than anything else lol.

Which leads me to the last change

Consistency and Capacity:
I heard it said by a haunt creator that the best way to scare someone is to break your own rules. HHN feels like it has backed itself into the proverbial corner in this aspect. It’s highly polished, highly attended, and highly consistent.

So much so that when they announce an IP these days you kind of already know what it’s going to sound like, look like, how they’re going to do the scares.

Yes, HHN is highly predictable

This is typically not something you want a horror event to be. There are exceptions of course, often yearly, but for the most part we know where the scares are coming from. We know how they do them. We know in a big room that there is a pedal and a strobe light waiting to go off…sometimes we’ve already seen it happen before we got in the room…We just know.

I’m not sure what the solution is here, but HHN used to be a bit unpredictable in its execution.

Imagine as a kid turning the corner and seeing Toon Lagoon covered in soap, and then creepy characters come jumping out. Unexpected to say the least. This would never be possible today.

To some degree I feel like I’ve experienced the same event for the last 5 years (oh yes, whatever is going on is a new phenomenon, whatever “it” is). It feels very plug and play at this point. Part of that again is because of how big the event is. It’s hard to change things up and surprise people when you’re strapped for space and every inch of the park needs to be used for foot traffic. It’s hard to be creative when you don’t have room.

The surprises back in the day are also a product of an event learning what worked and what didn’t. Today, they know, down to a T…and yet, it feels like they know a little too well. To the point that it’s a little unsurprising.

So, I think the answer to your question lies within your question. What is the difference between Old and New HHN? Well, one was an ever changing event that was morphing and growing through corporate turmoil and a resort finding its footing…The event now is a well established brand in a resort that’s healthier than its ever been.

Personally I will take a more healthy resort, a full event, and a bend towards more “by the numbers” than the way things were…Although the way things were are lasting memories that I look on fondly.

Awesome summary and review of Run. This right here is why it is one of my all time favorite houses. It was pure fun and chaos

You did forget one aspect tho... There were gates in the fences that the scareactors would open and close. Often times separating your group from each other and trying to reunite somewhere in the maze, all the while you're being chased, stalked, sprayed with water.

Man that house was pure amazeballs

 

[shiekra38]

Awesome summary and review of Run. This right here is why it is one of my all time favorite houses. It was pure fun and chaos

You did forget one aspect tho... There were gates in the fences that the scareactors would open and close. Often times separating your group from each other and trying to reunite somewhere in the maze, all the while you're being chased, stalked, sprayed with water.

Man that house was pure amazeballs

I don't remember the opening and closing fences, but it sure is possible that's how they tricked me lol

 

[HHN Maddux]

Something else I'd love is more IP's like Weeknd, in the sense that it's very experimental. It's a property that at first glance (as we saw this year), many would pass off as not scary and unbelonging to the event, but when actually executed, turns out to be a great house.

So... yeah, give me more experimental houses that make you say 'really?'. A musical house, like Heathers or Little Shop of Horrors. More video game houses, BioShock, DOOM! Houses that go against the status quo.

 

[Darko]

Something else I'd love is more IP's like Weeknd, in the sense that it's very experimental. It's a property that at first glance (as we saw this year), many would pass off as not scary and unbelonging to the event, but when actually executed, turns out to be a great house.

So... yeah, give me more experimental houses that make you say 'really?'. A musical house, like Heathers or Little Shop of Horrors. More video game houses, BioShock, DOOM! Houses that go against the status quo.

I’d totally be up for a Little Shop of Horrors house.