Splash Mountain Re-Theme

[Verdicoshna]

Disney fans want splash mountain to be re-themed due to current events.. Thoughts?

EDIT: Feel free to move/remove thread

 

[JawsVictim]

I don’t see an issue with the ride itself. The film it’s based on, however...yikes! I always thought the ride does a good job divorcing itself from its source material. The concern is valid, but IMO not justifiable enough to retheme the attraction.

 

[Nick]

To clear it up a bit, Disney fans want the ride to stay the same. Twitter wants the ride changed to Princess and the Frog due to Song of the South’s racist history.

For the record, I do actually think a PatF retheme would be pretty good. Especially in Disneyland where it’s right next to New Orleans Square.

 

[highdefrex]

Just my opinion, but I don’t see the point. I understand why this is something people are suddenly considering, which is a completely valid point of conversation, but it’s not like there’s an animatronic Uncle Remus or something on the ride, and Disney has pretty much distanced itself from Song of the South. I guarantee most people who ride Splash Mountain don’t even know the movie exists anyway; plus, the ride isn’t even an ode to the movie itself as a whole.

If we start down this road, then what next? We tear down Dumbo because of the crows? We tear down Peter Pan because of its problematic depiction of Native Americans? As it stands, I’d say Peter Pan has more of a reason to be rethemed than Splash Mountain because it actually has the characters in question in the ride.

Since Disney isn’t utilizing Splash Mountain to sell copies of Song of the South or get people into Disney+, nor do they even acknowledge its existence to the general public in the parks or otherwise, leave it be. There are bigger battles to be fought.

Edit: Since Nick posted right as I did, I didn’t see his post, but now that I have: I actually think a retheme to Princess and the Frog would be pretty cool. I love Splash Mountain, but it’s not because of the characters, just the experience and the song. Swap that all out with something comparable and I’m totally down with it! I’d take a loving PATF retheme over a stripped down Splash Mountain into a generic log ride any day.

 

[Nick]

Read through this Twitter thread for a fan imagine PatF overlay:

 

[JawsVictim]

Read through this Twitter thread for a fan imagine PatF overlay:

Oh wow! This would be incredible! Love PatF. I wouldn’t mind the overlay.

 

[highdefrex]

Read through this Twitter thread for a fan imagine PatF overlay:

Thank you for sharing that, dude! Reading through it, I can easily imagine it all. (That final lift hill would be incredible.) I’d be 100% on board with this were it to legitimately end up on the table if Disney can put that same level of thought and care into it.

 

[shiekra38]

Disney fans want splash mountain to be re-themed due to current events.. Thoughts?

EDIT: Feel free to move/remove thread

A refresh of Splash Mountain into another property, regardless of reasons, would be welcomed IMO

I've honestly never seen the movie "Song of the South" and don't know a lot of people who have.

 

[belloq87]

I'd be absolutely devastated to lose Splash Mountain. I think it's one of the very best things Imagineering has ever done, and their recent track record with changing rides because of social pressures (the auction scene in POTC) resulted in some of the very worst work Imagineering has ever done. As such, I have no faith a retheme would be anywhere near as good or memorable as the original incarnation, and "Zip A Dee Doo Dah" has transcended its film origins to become an absolutely iconic theme park song.

I'm fully open to Disney addressing/changing any specific elements in the current Splash Mountain that might be deemed to be offensive (the accents of the characters are certainly very stereotype-y, for example, and might perhaps be redone, albeit hopefully in a much better way than what they did to POTC), but throwing out the entire attraction would be one of the worst decisions I could fathom.

I'd also add that I'd be fully on-board with a PRINCESS AND THE FROG attraction showing up somewhere; I'd just rather not lose one of my favorite rides to get it.

 

[ChristopherSE]

Do I think Disney will do it any time soon? No. Do I care that much? Not really, and Splash is still one of my favorite rides. But if you’re interested in learning a little about the subject, here’s my cliffs notes/thoughts on it:

Splash definitely does a great job of distancing itself from Song of the South, but the characters and stories exist outside of the movie. Joel Chandler Harris wrote the Uncle Remus stories of Br’er Rabbit after his experience as a plantation apprentice. He took the oral stories he heard from slaves and transcribed them, also writing in their speaking style (this is where we get the “br’er” pronunciation of “brother” for the characters). As you can imagine, there has been some criticism of Harris over the years.

And then there’s the matter of Zip-a-Dee-Do-Dah. Which, it’s “happy slave” context in Song of the South is inherently problematic. But even if Disney has distanced the song enough from the movie (which they have pretty successfully done), there’s another issue with song. It’s very heavily influenced by a pre-Civil War song “Zip Coon”, which has a long history in minstrel blackface, as “Zip Coon” is a very common caricature in minstrel shows. So the Uncle Remus stereotype makes a lot of sense when you realize his song is traced back to a blackface character.

So, no there’s nothing explicitly racist about Splash Mountain. But the whole project was kinda born out of racism lol. Harris told (and profited from) stories that weren’t his, creating the Uncle Remus caricature that Disney would ultimately put up on screen. And as much as we like to think the animated characters (or the song!) are separate and the “not racist” parts that’s... not necessarily true. They’re still black stories, told by white men, and ingrained with stereotypes because of it. As far as Splash Mountain has been removed from Song of the South, that doesn’t quite solve Disney’s problem lol.

And with that, I offer the only re-theme concept I will accept:



And if anybody wants to learn more about Song of the South, I highly suggest this 6-part podcast from “You Must Remember This”. It’s by far the most comprehensive discussion I’ve seen, and gives a ton of context on what Hollywood was like at the time:

 

[Disneyhead]

In the long run, a Voodoo Witch Doctor could be viewed in a worse light than happy Reconstruction Period Sharecropper.

 

[belloq87]

Do I think Disney will do it any time soon? No. Do I care that much? Not really, and Splash is still one of my favorite rides. But if you’re interested in learning a little about the subject, here’s my cliffs notes/thoughts on it:

Splash definitely does a great job of distancing itself from Song of the South, but the characters and stories exist outside of the movie. Joel Chandler Harris wrote the Uncle Remus stories of Br’er Rabbit after his experience as a plantation apprentice. He took the oral stories he heard from slaves and transcribed them, also writing in their speaking style (this is where we get the “br’er” pronunciation of “brother” for the characters). As you can imagine, there has been some criticism of Harris over the years.

And then there’s the matter of Zip-a-Dee-Do-Dah. Which, it’s “happy slave” context in Song of the South is inherently problematic. But even if Disney has distanced the song enough from the movie (which they have pretty successfully done), there’s another issue with song. It’s very heavily influenced by a pre-Civil War song “Zip Coon”, which has a long history in minstrel blackface, as “Zip Coon” is a very common caricature in minstrel shows. So the Uncle Remus stereotype makes a lot of sense when you realize his song is traced back to a blackface character.

So, no there’s nothing explicitly racist about Splash Mountain. But the whole project was kinda born out of racism lol. Harris told (and profited from) stories that weren’t his, creating the Uncle Remus caricature that Disney would ultimately put up on screen. And as much as we like to think the animated characters (or the song!) are separate and the “not racist” parts that’s... not necessarily true. They’re still black stories, told by white men, and ingrained with stereotypes because of it. As far as Splash Mountain has been removed from Song of the South, that doesn’t quite solve Disney’s problem lol.

And with that, I offer the only re-theme concept I will accept:



And if anybody wants to learn more about Song of the South, I highly suggest this 6-part podcast from “You Must Remember This”. It’s by far the most comprehensive discussion I’ve seen, and gives a ton of context on what Hollywood was like at the time:

I appreciate this additional context.

I still think it's possible for a piece of work to transcend where it came from, and I'd put Splash Mountain in a very, very exclusive group of theme park attractions that are all-timers.

 

[Nick]

In the long run, a Voodoo Witch Doctor could be viewed in a worse light than happy Reconstruction Period Sharecropper.

You are WAY over simplifying Song of the South’s highly racist tones, so much so that Disney won’t even release it.

There’d also be heavy symbolism in retheming a ride based heavily racist movie with Disney’s first black princess. I really don’t think Dr. Facilier would be a big problem at all culturally and he’s one of the most beloved modern Disney villains (post 2000).

 

[belloq87]

There’d also be heavy symbolism in retheming a heavily racist ride

Is it really, though? The ride itself, divorced from the source? Heavily?

I'm genuinely not trying to be argumentative or open any cans of worms. I just find the claim that Splash Mountain is unequivocally "heavily racist" to be a questionable characterization.

SONG OF THE SOUTH? Yes.

 

[Nick]

Is it really, though? The ride itself, divorced from the source? Heavily?

I'm genuinely not trying to be argumentative or open any cans of worms. I just find the claim that Splash Mountain is unequivocally "heavily racist" to be a questionable characterization.

SONG OF THE SOUTH? Yes.

I worded it wrongly. I meant ride based on a heavily racist movie.

So we’re along the same lines.

 

[shiekra38]

The crows in Dumbo come to mind as well...I don't think they're present on the ride at all

Buuuut.

 

[Nick]

The crows in Dumbo come to mind as well...I don't think they're present on the ride at all

Buuuut.

Dumbo is a bit of a different story. In the grand scheme of the movie, it's a small aspect compared to how Song of the South is just overtly racist through and through. The fact that it makes for a fun ride while ignoring those elements actually goes to prove how harmful movies like SotS were and exactly WHY they were made. It's actually sort of cute when you look at from a certain POV (thus Splash Mountain). But in the context of the movie, they try to use the "cute" part to mask the racist elements and make it seem normal/okay.

 

[Andysol]

The world has gone mad.

It’s fine if someone thinks a PatF retheme of Splash would be cool- whether it happened 10 years ago or tomorrow. Although PatF is my favorite animated movie, I wouldn’t want to lose what I think is the best ride Disney has ever created for a chance at a retheme that may or may not be great;.

But the events of the last weeks shouldn’t change anyone’s mind whatsoever on the subject matter. If it did, you have a problem.

 

[Nick]

This whole is just stupid.
The world has gone mad.

It’s fine if someone thinks a PatF retheme of Splash would be cool- whether it happened 10 years ago or tomorrow. Although PatF is my favorite animated movie, I wouldn’t want to lose what I think is the best ride Disney has ever created for a chance at a retheme that may or may not be great;.

But the events of the last weeks shouldn’t change anyone’s mind whatsoever on the subject matter. If it did, you have a problem.

I certainly don't think doing anything to Splash should really even be on WDI's mind, It is a perfect ride that comes from unfortunate source material. While there is certainly a conversation to be had for if it's appropriate for a ride to be based off of Song of the South, like you say, it's also so well done that I don't really want to take a chance that a redo of it might work out. Of course we're speaking as theme park fans. If Disney reacts to social pressures is another question, especially if it persists.

I do think that a PatF ride is something that should get a little New Orleans miniland with a ride/restaurant. But it would be nice if it got it's own design from the start instead of being retrofitted in.

 

[Jamesh22]

PATF highly themed E Ticket - YES (Shanghi Pirates tech anyone?!)
Retheme Splash Mountain which 99% of people don't even know is based on the SOTS movie - NO

I do think this raises a point about more diverse representaion in Disney parks and building a PATF ride would definitely be a step in the right direction.