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The Icons and Lore Thread

GA-MBIT

Member
Jun 16, 2017
679
Haines City, FL
Me and @Legacy had a whole discussion over why they wouldn’t bring her back. Either it’s because Universal doesn’t like the idea of an urban legend being copyrighted (I myself don’t have a problem with it; it’s not like Bobbie Weiner’s copyrighting Day of the Dead), the poor attendance rate of 2008 (especially considering the success of Carnival of Carnage), or of a certain employee (Roddy) who did some… not so great stuff and that man was heavily involved with the Bloody Mary icon.
In terms of Icons, Jack sells better/as good as Mary and they don't have to share the profits with anyone who frankly didn't do anything to deserve it. In terms of IPs, if you have the choice between Chucky or Bloody Mary to throw on merch and ads, you go with Chucky cause media properties move tickets faster than urban legends like Mary would.

I think judging by how they still use other Roddy creations and aren't afraid to throw Bloody Mary a bone to some extent given the house cameo, I don't think he has anything to do with it. It's purely business.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
25,117
Orlando
I would like to see a future Icon be a POC, even if it's an unofficial one because of marketing BS like Bone was during 27. The color of someone's skin doesn't matter when it comes to any of these characters, but representation also matters.

There's just an extreme lack of diversity among the icons, I feel. And that extends further - Eddie, The Director, and The Usher are all into movies in a screwed up way. They're just slightly different versions of the same character.
 

OhHaiInternet95

Veteran Member
Aug 18, 2017
4,313
Me and @Legacy had a whole discussion over why they wouldn’t bring her back. Either it’s because Universal doesn’t like the idea of an urban legend being copyrighted (I myself don’t have a problem with it; it’s not like Bobbie Weiner’s copyrighting Day of the Dead), the poor attendance rate of 2008 (especially considering the success of Carnival of Carnage), or of a certain employee (Roddy) who did some… not so great stuff and that man was heavily involved with the Bloody Mary icon.

Roddy is/was a creative genius so that's a shame, whatever it was.

I'm kind of surprised they bothered to license her in the first place and didn't just use Crowe.
 

shiekra38

Legendary Member
Dec 13, 2009
14,019
Florida
I would like to see a future Icon be a POC, even if it's an unofficial one because of marketing BS like Bone was during 27. The color of someone's skin doesn't matter when it comes to any of these characters and representation also matters.

There's just an extreme lack of diversity among the icons, I feel. And that extends further - Eddie, The Director, and The Usher are all into movies in a screwed up way. They're just slightly different versions of the same character.
I was talking with someone on Twitter about this today. It would be incredibly easy to do and if they're serious about re-introducing the icon "thing", this is a great way to diversify the line-up and help the character to stand out.

This year made me realize how much they could really shake up their formula and diversify their storytelling.

Roddy is/was a creative genius so that's a shame, whatever it was.

I'm kind of surprised they bothered to license her in the first place and didn't just use Crowe.
I hadn't heard about this either, but I know it's not a surprise (ahem Gary Goddard)...

Still though, I think there's many many people to thank for how 2008 turned out, and it's still one of my favorite Icons and years
 

OhHaiInternet95

Veteran Member
Aug 18, 2017
4,313
I was talking with someone on Twitter about this today. It would be incredibly easy to do and if they're serious about re-introducing the icon "thing", this is a great way to diversify the line-up and help the character to stand out. This year made me realize how much they could really shake up their formula and diversify their storytelling.
As if the bean counters will allow that. :rolleyes:

Reading Epcot discussion threads, especially on Magic, reminds me so much of HHN discussion.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
25,117
Orlando
The IP thing is still working out for them I guess...as long as Netflix keeps turning out stuff
Only two IPs are used in the commercial this year and only 4 technical IPs (I only consider it to be 3 as Bride is actually a sequel house to the movie and all original). This event doesn't need that many IPs for people to show up.
 

shiekra38

Legendary Member
Dec 13, 2009
14,019
Florida
Only two IPs are used in the commercial this year and only 4 technical IPs (I only consider it to be 3 as Bride is actually a sequel house to the movie and all original). This event doesn't need that many IPs for people to show up.
I agree, if they can find that one that really markets well (i.e. Stranger Things, Hill House, Horror Story and the much maligned Walking Dead)

Something overarching would be great and an icon to tie it all together

I thought Carnival of Carnage was the perfect melding of the two ideas and it felt very cohesive
 
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Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
25,117
Orlando
I agree, if they can find that one that really markets well (i.e. Stranger Things, Hill House, Horror Story and the much maligned Walking Dead)

Something overarching would be great and an icon to tie it all together

I thought Carnival of Carnage was the perfect melding of the two ideas and it felt very cohesive
I know many don't want to hear it, but it's not impossible we see Stranger Things again next year considering Season 4 is coming out in the Spring. I don't want to get into spec, i'm just sort of bouncing off of what you were saying for what the major IP may be next year.

Buffy would be something of an interesting house, but it's Fox/Disney owned, so likely off-limits.
 

pumpkinbot343

Rookie
Aug 12, 2021
121
2008 was my all time a favorite years and I liked it better than 2007 in many ways

Although, it seems the seeds for modern day HHN were planted in 2007/09
Episodes 1,3, and 7 from here podcast touch on the 2008 event. Two of them feature Roddy; but they still give some insight into Bloody Mary’s year.
 
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MikePat

Rookie
Sep 6, 2021
102
Years like HHN 18 and HHN 21 had great original houses and storytelling with new Icons. However, even those years had IPs. HHN 18 originally had two IPs with the unbuild AWIL, and HHN 21 had The Thing 2011. HHN can still have IPs in years with great original storytelling and Icons to tie it all together.

We are entering a new decade of horrah, and that has me interested in how and if a Icon role will return through characters other than Jack. Now, if we are blessed with HHN: Year of the Bear this decade, then I and (likely) HHN fans across the country would be dancing with joy.
 

OhHaiInternet95

Veteran Member
Aug 18, 2017
4,313
Years like HHN 18 and HHN 21 had great original houses and storytelling with new Icons. However, even those years had IPs. HHN 18 originally had two IPs with the unbuild AWIL, and HHN 21 had The Thing 2011. HHN can still have IPs in years with great original storytelling and Icons to tie it together.

We are entering a new decade of horrah, and that has me interested in how and if a Icon role will return through characters other than Jack. Now, if we are blessed with HHN: Year of the Bear this decade, then I and (likely) HHN fans across the country would be dancing with joy.
I really hate to be (keep being) Debbie Downer, but I'm not optimistic about the future of the event. I just see more and more creative constraints being added--marketing/management's demands, safety and crowd protocols, sensitive subject material, it just seems like they're running out of things they can do. Kind of thinking about trying local haunts next year instead.

But, here's to a great New Decade of Horrah nonetheless. Hoping for the best, and also trying to concentrate on what I've liked from Uni--like giving us an awesome new coaster. :toast:
 

pumpkinbot343

Rookie
Aug 12, 2021
121
I really hate to be (keep being) Debbie Downer, but I'm not optimistic about the future of the event. I just see more and more creative constraints being added--marketing/management's demands, safety and crowd protocols, sensitive subject material, it just seems like they're running out of things they can do. Kind of thinking about trying local haunts next year instead.
What’s different about local haunts?
 

kingcooger

Veteran Member
Feb 7, 2014
1,290
What’s different about local haunts?
No subject is taboo

Actors can follow you from scene to scene

They try out different scare tactics (chainsaws overhead, bungees that could theoretically touch guests if they so desired, etc)

Pulsing lines hard

And some have immersive show scenes where you are trapped in a room while things happen around you (stopping the flow of the crowd to tell a story or create a scare)

Some also include crawl spaces, slides, and might divide up your party on purpose.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
25,117
Orlando
What’s different about local haunts?
They can pretty much do anything. Local haunts are usually way more intense. No conga lines. etc.

Screamageddon for example gives you the option to wear a necklace (for free) which lets the scareactors know that they can touch you and it's a whole interactive theatrical experience.
 
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OhHaiInternet95

Veteran Member
Aug 18, 2017
4,313
No subject is taboo

Actors can follow you from scene to scene

They try out different scare tactics (chainsaws overhead, bungees that could theoretically touch guests if they so desired, etc)

Pulsing lines hard

And some have immersive show scenes where you are trapped in a room while things happen around you (stopping the flow of the crowd to tell a story or create a scare)
They can pretty much do anything. Local haunts are usually way more intense. Screamageddon for example gives you the option to wear a necklace (for free) which lets the scareactors know that they can touch you and it's a whole interactive theatrical experience.
Yeah. The few posts about being formulaic in the review thread really stuck with me--I just don't know what new things they could do even if they wanted to.
 

MikePat

Rookie
Sep 6, 2021
102
I really hate to be (keep being) Debbie Downer, but I'm not optimistic about the future of the event. I just see more and more creative constraints being added--marketing's demands, safety and crowd protocols, sensitive subject material, it just seems like they're running out of things they can do. Kind of thinking about trying local haunts next year instead.
That's the ultimate thing. Unrealistically, the HHN Bear and other new Icons would be my hopes. Realistically, Jack and *maybe* a previous Icon would return as Icon's once in a while.

I hope this next decade can at least be like the rest of the other HHN decades and have its own sort of unique era. We will find out in the next upcoming years...
 
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kingcooger

Veteran Member
Feb 7, 2014
1,290
Yeah. The few posts about being formulaic in the review thread really stuck with me--I just don't know what new things they could do even if they wanted to.
Here's a good show scene example:

I was at a haunt where we were supposed to be in a prison and we entered into a long hallway (about thirty to forty feet) with cells on our right and just black wall on our left. At the end of the hallway was a girl beckoning us forward. We heeded her call as she seemed panicked and kept asking to be let out before "he" arrived.

While we were talking to her trying to figure out how to help, she screamed and pointed down the hallway we had just walked down. At the end stood a stiltwalker with a huge sledgehammer. He took a few steps down the hallway and stood underneath the furthest light. He "smashed" the light with his sledgehammer and proceeded to the next one. After smashing three more lights, we were in complete darkness and could only hear his footsteps. A light came on, a shot of wind hit us, and his hammer was swinging above our heads while an escape door opened beside us.

That would never happen at HHN
 

OhHaiInternet95

Veteran Member
Aug 18, 2017
4,313
Here's a good show scene example:

I was at a haunt where we were supposed to be in a prison and we entered into a long hallway (about thirty to forty feet) with cells on our right and just black wall on our left. At the end of the hallway was a girl beckoning us forward. We heeded her call as she seemed panicked and kept asking to be let out before "he" arrived.

While we were talking to her trying to figure out how to help, she screamed and pointed down the hallway we had just walked down. At the end stood a stiltwalker with a huge sledgehammer. He took a few steps down the hallway and stood underneath the furthest light. He "smashed" the light with his sledgehammer and proceeded to the next one. After smashing three more lights, we were in complete darkness and could only hear his footsteps. A light came on, a shot of wind hit us, and his hammer was swinging above our heads while an escape door opened beside us.

That would never happen at HHN
To be fair, I don't think HHN would have ever done this. I'm just talking about houses with new themes and gimmicks of some sort.