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Theatrical Future/PVOD Thread

quinnmac000

Veteran Member
May 14, 2014
5,620
Seoul, Korea

HandsomePete

Member
Jul 8, 2019
537
They have a point though.... the film got all the upside of in-theater marketing for months and was released when there was nothing else to do.

Theaters are the best deterrent the industry has against piracy - I would note that there have been zero articles about how proud Universal is for also (probably) setting a record for quickest film to ever have a clean 1080p copy to hit torrent sites.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando

It appears theater owners are panicking....The longer this goes on, the faster theatres go obsolete...
What big movies are coming out on VOD to make theaters obsolete? Scoob! Certainly isn’t going to set the world on fire. Maybe theaters lose a lot of the lower tiered animated movies, but notice not a single tent pole film has opted for VOD over staying in theaters.

Theaters are fine because they are needed for big budget movies to be profitable.
 

Cup_Of_Coffee

Veteran Member
Aug 7, 2018
4,270
They have a point though.... the film got all the upside of in-theater marketing for months and was released when there was nothing else to do.

Theaters are the best deterrent the industry has against piracy - I would note that there have been zero articles about how proud Universal is for also (probably) setting a record for quickest film to ever have a clean 1080p copy to hit torrent sites.
I mean, not the film or Universal's fault they got that advertising, they were planning a month before it opened to open the film up, no one expected this.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando
I mean, not the film or Universal's fault they got that advertising, they were planning a month before it opened to open the film up, no one expected this.
The theater owners are mad over principle. Obviously this wasn’t anyone’s fault, but unlike Disney with Artemis Fowl or WB with Scoob!, Universal pissed off theater owners by not consulting with them about the move beforehand and instead all theaters found out about it the way you and I did.

They took it as a sign of disrespect.
 
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AlexanderMBush

Legendary Member
Nov 23, 2013
17,695
Arizona

It appears theater owners are panicking....The longer this goes on, the faster theatres go obsolete...
To add to this, AMC is out-right not even going to be licensing films by Universal in theaters due to the financial success of Troll's.

 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando
To add to this, AMC is out-right not even going to be licensing films by Universal in theaters due to the financial success of Troll's.

Yeah, this is the theaters playing hardball. Universal made back their money on Trolls sure, but Fast 9, Jurassic World, etc? Too bad. The theaters were outright disrespected by Universal not even telling them Trolls would be going to VOD and this is them getting back at them.
 

quinnmac000

Veteran Member
May 14, 2014
5,620
Seoul, Korea
Yeah, this is the theaters playing hardball. Universal made back their money on Trolls sure, but Fast 9, Jurassic World, etc? Too bad. The theaters were outright disrespected by Universal not even telling them Trolls would be going to VOD and this is them getting back at them.
The thing is they did...here is the letter....

Donna Langley
Chairman
Universal Studios

Dear Donna,
At this time of national emergency and the coronavirus wreaking havoc on the entire world, I hope that you and your loved ones are healthy and safe. I worry – and I wish the best for – the health of all of our industry colleagues. Never in our lifetimes has there been a more challenging time.

Amidst a global pandemic as a backdrop, I wish we were spared from also having to address a different issue that arises from Universal actions currently underway.
For 100 years, AMC Theatres has served as a strategically critical and highly profitable distribution platform for movie makers, and for all that time the exclusivity of the theatrical release has been fundamental. When a movie is “Only in Theaters,” consumers perceive it to be higher quality entertainment. Countless filmmakers and moviegoers believe that their creative works are best enjoyed by consumers on the big screen. And we all know that those theatrical releases indeed boost publicity, positive word-of-mouth, critical acclaim and downstream revenues.

For much of the past four and a half years, I have been in direct dialogue with Jeff Shell and Peter Levinsohn of Universal about the importance of a robust theatrical window to the viability of the motion picture exhibition industry. Throughout that time, AMC has expressed a willingness to consider alternatives to the current windowing strategy common in our industry, where the aim of such alternatives is to improve both studio profitability and theater operator profitability.
Universal stated it only pursued a direct-to-home entertainment release for “Trolls World Tour” because theaters were closed and Universal was committed to a lucrative toy licensing deal. We had our doubts that this was wholly Universal’s motivations, as it has been a longstanding desire by Universal to go to the home day and date. Nonetheless, we accepted this action as an exception to our longstanding business practices in these unprecedented times.
In today’s Wall Street Journal, Jeff Shell is quoted as saying that:

“The results for ‘Trolls World Tour’ have exceeded our expectations and demonstrated the viability of PVOD,” Mr. Shell said. “As soon as theaters reopen, we expect to release movies on both formats.”
This radical change by Universal to the business model that currently exists between our two companies represents nothing but downside for us and is categorically unacceptable to AMC Entertainment, the worlds largest collection of movie theatres.
Going forward, AMC will not license any Universal movies in any of our 1,000 theatres globally on these terms.

Accordingly, we want to be absolutely clear, so that there is no ambiguity of any kind. AMC believes that with this proposed action to go to the home and theatres simultaneously, Universal is breaking the business model and dealings between our two companies. It assumes that we will meekly accept a reshaped view of how studios and exhibitors should interact, with zero concern on Universal’s part as to how its actions affect us. It also presumes that Universal in fact can have its cake and eat it too, that Universal film product can be released to the home and theatres at the same time, without modification to the current economic arrangements between us.

It is disappointing to us, but Jeff’s comments as to Universal’s unilateral actions and intentions have left us with no choice. Therefore, effectively immediately AMC will no longer play any Universal movies in any of our theatres in the United States, Europe or the Middle East. This policy affects any and all Universal movies per se, goes into effect today and as our theatres reopen, and is not some hollow or ill-considered threat. Incidentally, this policy is not aimed solely at Universal out of pique or to be punitive in any way, it also extends to any movie maker who unilaterally abandons current windowing practices absent good faith negotiations between us, so that they as distributor and we as exhibitor both benefit and neither are hurt from such changes. Currently, with the press comment today, Universal is the only studio contemplating a wholesale change to the status quo. Hence, this immediate communication in response.

AMC has invested significant time and energy with Universal executives over the past few years trying to figure out a new windows model that would be beneficial both for your studio and for our theatre operations. While Universal’s unilateral pronouncements on this issue are unpalatable to us, as has always been the case, AMC is willing to sit down with Universal to discuss different windows strategies and different economic models between your company and ours. However, in the absence of such discussions, and an acceptable conclusion thereto, our decades of incredibly successful business activity together has sadly come to an end.
Sincerely,
Adam Aron
CEO and President
AMC Entertainment
 
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Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando
The thing is they did...here is the letter....

Donna Langley
Chairman
Universal Studios

Dear Donna,
At this time of national emergency and the coronavirus wreaking havoc on the entire world, I hope that you and your loved ones are healthy and safe. I worry – and I wish the best for – the health of all of our industry colleagues. Never in our lifetimes has there been a more challenging time.

Amidst a global pandemic as a backdrop, I wish we were spared from also having to address a different issue that arises from Universal actions currently underway.
For 100 years, AMC Theatres has served as a strategically critical and highly profitable distribution platform for movie makers, and for all that time the exclusivity of the theatrical release has been fundamental. When a movie is “Only in Theaters,” consumers perceive it to be higher quality entertainment. Countless filmmakers and moviegoers believe that their creative works are best enjoyed by consumers on the big screen. And we all know that those theatrical releases indeed boost publicity, positive word-of-mouth, critical acclaim and downstream revenues.

For much of the past four and a half years, I have been in direct dialogue with Jeff Shell and Peter Levinsohn of Universal about the importance of a robust theatrical window to the viability of the motion picture exhibition industry. Throughout that time, AMC has expressed a willingness to consider alternatives to the current windowing strategy common in our industry, where the aim of such alternatives is to improve both studio profitability and theater operator profitability.
Universal stated it only pursued a direct-to-home entertainment release for “Trolls World Tour” because theaters were closed and Universal was committed to a lucrative toy licensing deal. We had our doubts that this was wholly Universal’s motivations, as it has been a longstanding desire by Universal to go to the home day and date. Nonetheless, we accepted this action as an exception to our longstanding business practices in these unprecedented times.
In today’s Wall Street Journal, Jeff Shell is quoted as saying that:

“The results for ‘Trolls World Tour’ have exceeded our expectations and demonstrated the viability of PVOD,” Mr. Shell said. “As soon as theaters reopen, we expect to release movies on both formats.”
This radical change by Universal to the business model that currently exists between our two companies represents nothing but downside for us and is categorically unacceptable to AMC Entertainment, the worlds largest collection of movie theatres.
Going forward, AMC will not license any Universal movies in any of our 1,000 theatres globally on these terms.

Accordingly, we want to be absolutely clear, so that there is no ambiguity of any kind. AMC believes that with this proposed action to go to the home and theatres simultaneously, Universal is breaking the business model and dealings between our two companies. It assumes that we will meekly accept a reshaped view of how studios and exhibitors should interact, with zero concern on Universal’s part as to how its actions affect us. It also presumes that Universal in fact can have its cake and eat it too, that Universal film product can be released to the home and theatres at the same time, without modification to the current economic arrangements between us.

It is disappointing to us, but Jeff’s comments as to Universal’s unilateral actions and intentions have left us with no choice. Therefore, effectively immediately AMC will no longer play any Universal movies in any of our theatres in the United States, Europe or the Middle East. This policy affects any and all Universal movies per se, goes into effect today and as our theatres reopen, and is not some hollow or ill-considered threat. Incidentally, this policy is not aimed solely at Universal out of pique or to be punitive in any way, it also extends to any movie maker who unilaterally abandons current windowing practices absent good faith negotiations between us, so that they as distributor and we as exhibitor both benefit and neither are hurt from such changes. Currently, with the press comment today, Universal is the only studio contemplating a wholesale change to the status quo. Hence, this immediate communication in response.

AMC has invested significant time and energy with Universal executives over the past few years trying to figure out a new windows model that would be beneficial both for your studio and for our theatre operations. While Universal’s unilateral pronouncements on this issue are unpalatable to us, as has always been the case, AMC is willing to sit down with Universal to discuss different windows strategies and different economic models between your company and ours. However, in the absence of such discussions, and an acceptable conclusion thereto, our decades of incredibly successful business activity together has sadly come to an end.
Sincerely,
Adam Aron
CEO and President
AMC Entertainment
They told them last second.

Both Disney with Artemis and WB with Scoob talked it over for weeks with theaters because they know that a good relationship between the theaters and studio is important. Universal really burnt a bridge here.
 
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Jerroddragon

V.I.P.
Jun 27, 2017
1,404
To add to this, AMC is out-right not even going to be licensing films by Universal in theaters due to the financial success of Troll's.

Booooo and stupid. So one Fing crappy film was released. Who cares, if AMC really does stop showing Universal movies, I wont be coming back to A-list.

So what about WB? They can show scooby doo online but not Universal? Disney moved films from theaters to Disney Plus.

This just seems like a dumb thing to get mad over

They told them last second.

Both Disney with Artemis and WB with Scoob talked it over for weeks with theaters because they know that a good relationship between the theaters and studio is important. Universal really burnt a bridge here.
I like how if they just talked to them it would be ok...like AMC would be seeing Zero Dollars either way
 
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Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando
I like how if they just talked to them it would be ok...like AMC would be seeing Zero Dollars either way
It's about respect. Universal treated the theaters with very little of it by not letting them know until last minute. The theaters make these studios so much money, the least they could do is act appreciative and not treat them like they did.

Think what you guys want, but the theaters have every right to be mad.
 

Jerroddragon

V.I.P.
Jun 27, 2017
1,404
The thing is they did...here is the letter....

Donna Langley
Chairman
Universal Studios

Dear Donna,
At this time of national emergency and the coronavirus wreaking havoc on the entire world, I hope that you and your loved ones are healthy and safe. I worry – and I wish the best for – the health of all of our industry colleagues. Never in our lifetimes has there been a more challenging time.

Amidst a global pandemic as a backdrop, I wish we were spared from also having to address a different issue that arises from Universal actions currently underway.
For 100 years, AMC Theatres has served as a strategically critical and highly profitable distribution platform for movie makers, and for all that time the exclusivity of the theatrical release has been fundamental. When a movie is “Only in Theaters,” consumers perceive it to be higher quality entertainment. Countless filmmakers and moviegoers believe that their creative works are best enjoyed by consumers on the big screen. And we all know that those theatrical releases indeed boost publicity, positive word-of-mouth, critical acclaim and downstream revenues.

For much of the past four and a half years, I have been in direct dialogue with Jeff Shell and Peter Levinsohn of Universal about the importance of a robust theatrical window to the viability of the motion picture exhibition industry. Throughout that time, AMC has expressed a willingness to consider alternatives to the current windowing strategy common in our industry, where the aim of such alternatives is to improve both studio profitability and theater operator profitability.
Universal stated it only pursued a direct-to-home entertainment release for “Trolls World Tour” because theaters were closed and Universal was committed to a lucrative toy licensing deal. We had our doubts that this was wholly Universal’s motivations, as it has been a longstanding desire by Universal to go to the home day and date. Nonetheless, we accepted this action as an exception to our longstanding business practices in these unprecedented times.
In today’s Wall Street Journal, Jeff Shell is quoted as saying that:

“The results for ‘Trolls World Tour’ have exceeded our expectations and demonstrated the viability of PVOD,” Mr. Shell said. “As soon as theaters reopen, we expect to release movies on both formats.”
This radical change by Universal to the business model that currently exists between our two companies represents nothing but downside for us and is categorically unacceptable to AMC Entertainment, the worlds largest collection of movie theatres.
Going forward, AMC will not license any Universal movies in any of our 1,000 theatres globally on these terms.

Accordingly, we want to be absolutely clear, so that there is no ambiguity of any kind. AMC believes that with this proposed action to go to the home and theatres simultaneously, Universal is breaking the business model and dealings between our two companies. It assumes that we will meekly accept a reshaped view of how studios and exhibitors should interact, with zero concern on Universal’s part as to how its actions affect us. It also presumes that Universal in fact can have its cake and eat it too, that Universal film product can be released to the home and theatres at the same time, without modification to the current economic arrangements between us.

It is disappointing to us, but Jeff’s comments as to Universal’s unilateral actions and intentions have left us with no choice. Therefore, effectively immediately AMC will no longer play any Universal movies in any of our theatres in the United States, Europe or the Middle East. This policy affects any and all Universal movies per se, goes into effect today and as our theatres reopen, and is not some hollow or ill-considered threat. Incidentally, this policy is not aimed solely at Universal out of pique or to be punitive in any way, it also extends to any movie maker who unilaterally abandons current windowing practices absent good faith negotiations between us, so that they as distributor and we as exhibitor both benefit and neither are hurt from such changes. Currently, with the press comment today, Universal is the only studio contemplating a wholesale change to the status quo. Hence, this immediate communication in response.

AMC has invested significant time and energy with Universal executives over the past few years trying to figure out a new windows model that would be beneficial both for your studio and for our theatre operations. While Universal’s unilateral pronouncements on this issue are unpalatable to us, as has always been the case, AMC is willing to sit down with Universal to discuss different windows strategies and different economic models between your company and ours. However, in the absence of such discussions, and an acceptable conclusion thereto, our decades of incredibly successful business activity together has sadly come to an end.
Sincerely,
Adam Aron
CEO and President
AMC Entertainment
Has Universal said any of this publicly? I follow lots of people who talk about movies and no one has said anything about Universal changing its model going forward

It's about respect.
Lol as if Disney Respects them they are producing Marvel shows, movies for Disney Plus only and take like the most Percent of any other movie company from theaters plus put hard deals on them like having to keep Disney movies in the biggest theaters for weeks even if a bigger film comes out.
 

Clive

aka Fallow
Staff member
Moderator
May 26, 2010
3,563
It's about respect.
They're corporations.

If "respect" is going to result in AMC cutting off its nose to spite its face, then they don't deserve to stay in business. And they won't if they don't play Fast & Furious, Illumination films, Jurassic World, and whatever else. It's an embarrassing bit of bluster that will reveal how little leverage they actually have at this point.
 

Nick

Staff member
Moderator
Sep 22, 2011
22,668
Orlando
They're corporations.

If "respect" is going to result in AMC cutting off its nose to spite its face, then they don't deserve to stay in business. And they won't if they don't play Fast & Furious, Illumination films, Jurassic World, and whatever else. It's an embarrassing bit of bluster that will reveal how little leverage they actually have at this point.
You can bet that AMC will play those movies, they'll just try and get a higher percentage from Universal. Universal needs the largest theater chain in America to be alive and on their side. If AMC doesn't show Universal's movies, they make significantly less money.