Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[TomTheRiddle]

After all of this I would love to see a massive CityWalk expansion almost to the point where we have CityWalk East/West (or North/South, depending on which way we view the expansion) with the size and shopping of USH's CityWalk. They could have a legitimate concert venue that replaces the stage in USF (or Hard Rock).

I still am very torn about the potential of a third gate just because I'm not sure what direction they'd take it.

And unless the Water Park is really, really well done, like Atlantis Aquaventure/Schlitterbahn good, than I won't go just because it is a water park.

 

[Nick]

After all of this I would love to see a massive CityWalk expansion almost to the point where we have CityWalk East/West (or North/South, depending on which way we view the expansion) with the size and shopping of USH's CityWalk. They could have a legitimate concert venue that replaces the stage in USF (or Hard Rock).

I still am very torn about the potential of a third gate just because I'm not sure what direction they'd take it.

And unless the Water Park is really, really well done, like Atlantis Aquaventure/Schlitterbahn good, than I won't go just because it is a water park.

While a legit concert venue would be wonderful, they would definitely have to find a way to charge. In USH, the 5 Towers concerts are free. They don't want free here because the concerts in USF really drive attendance and revenue on some nights. Who knows though, would love to see it.

 

[IzzyB]

While a legit concert venue would be wonderful, they would definitely have to find a way to charge. In USH, the 5 Towers concerts are free. They don't want free here because the concerts in USF really drive attendance and revenue on some nights. Who knows though, would love to see it.

Agreed. It would have to be something like if you have a park pass you can get into the concert. But this still would mess things up like Mardi Gras because the parade is so popular.

Wow, all of this would be crazy. I was thinking it would not be possible because there is really not enough usable land near Uni, but if they build some kind of monorail system, it would work. But that would take a lot from the city too and would be a huge expense. My guess is it depends on how much Phase 2 pulls in to see if they have the money to do this. But to make it a "resort" like Disney it would need some kind of monorail system. I realize Disney did not connect all of their parks, but their bus system works for connections, but no way could Uni depend on buses because of traffic. Unlike Disney they would be dealing with public roads with real rush hour issues. Plus add in tourist traffic on I-drive and you are looking at major issues with trying to do a busing system as your main transportation. Disney does not have to worry about that since all of there stuff is within Disney property and they don't have to worry about general public Orlando traffic.

 

[maxairmike]

Doing an eyeball comparison of the TTC to Epcot route with the distance from the current Universal area to the large open land south of Lockheed, it is very similar no matter if you start from the parking garages, or from the Major Blvd. area. Marni/Spirit, if you happen to read this, any insight on the 1980s cost of the Epcot monorail? An inflation index wouldn't be precise, but I think it would be close enough for a general idea.

 

[IzzyB]

Here is a good article, look at the last myth

http://www.yesterland.com/monoraillegends.html

It states the Las Vegas Monorail in 2004 cost $654 million for 4.4 Miles. This would be more true to life than comparing it to Disney Monorail, since like Las Vegas Uni would have to deal with property owners and right of ways like Las Vegas did.

Which Ironically doing quick directions from point A to point B it shows around 4 miles....so with everything it would also be around 4.4 miles

 

[Andy]

I'm about 97% positive we will see either a major expansion to CW or another shopping district altogether.

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Here is a good article, look at the last myth

http://www.yesterland.com/monoraillegends.html

It states the Las Vegas Monorail in 2004 cost $654 million for 4.4 Miles. This would be more true to life than comparing it to Disney Monorail, since like Las Vegas Uni would have to deal with property owners and right of ways like Las Vegas did.

Which Ironically doing quick directions from point A to point B it shows around 4 miles....so with everything it would also be around 4.4 miles

Well with TDO in charge and imagineers middle and upper management cuts were looking at 2.1 Billion for a monorail expansion at WDW.

 

[JungleSkip]

I'm about 97% positive we will see either a major expansion to CW or another shopping district altogether.

After buying land, right?

Because as of right now, CW is the most land locked, but that's also because it was horribly designed in the first place, IMO.

 

[Andy]

Horribly designed from a sales and profit pov? I mean if thats the case then I would say DTD is the most horribly designed area IMO.

 

[JungleSkip]

Horribly designed from a sales and profit pov? I mean if thats the case then I would say DTD is the most horribly designed area IMO.

From a layout and shop choice point of view.

And I'd wager that World of Disney probably rakes in more cash than any of the stores at City Walk.

 

[Andy]

And I'd wager that World of Disney probably rakes in more cash than any of the stores at City Walk.

No arguing there But lets ask the other vendors...

 

[JungleSkip]

No arguing there But lets ask the other vendors...

The other vendors do fine. Most are the highest grossing stores in their lines.

City Walk, IMO, just doesn't have any shops worth going to. The restaurants and clubs are fine, for the most part. But I think the shopping aspect could use to be stepped up a few notches.

 

[Andy]

Well thats where your wrong, Citywalk is a flagship location for many of the vendors located there and thanks to Potters crowds they are achieving record sales years. No opinion about it, they make LOADS of money as I'm sure DTD does. But from the people who I have talked to who work in management in several stores they have seen a decline in sales at DTD for the past two years. Now would you believe the Board Walks sales are actually up from the vendors I've spoken with.

For those who are close to me personally, they know I know retail within the attractions area. Its what I do...

 

[JungleSkip]

Well thats where your wrong, Citywalk is a flagship location for many of the vendors located there and thanks to Potters crowds they are achieving record sales years. No opinion about it, they make LOADS of money as I'm sure DTD does. But from the people who I have talked to who work in management in several stores they have seen a decline in sales at DTD for the past two years. Now would you believe the Board Walks sales are actually up from the vendors I've spoken with.

For those who are close to me personally, they know I know retail within the attractions area. Its what I do...

I never said that the shops at City Walk weren't profitable. I said they're all lame, and without the theme parks wouldn't be a driving force for CityWalk.

And of course sales at DTD have slumped. 1/3 of the place has been shuttered for 1/2 a decade. But they still make loads of money. Most of them aren't any better than the CityWalk offerings, though.

 

[Andy]

Oh well lame yeah thats fine

 

[Nick]

The current CityWalk design is perfect for something like this. Every HAS TO pass through it to get to the parks, which would be the reason why most of the stores would be the most profitable. However, as Skip said, most of the stores are also lame. The clubs are cool, but i'd love another district much more similar to USH's CityWalk in terms of content.

 

[UniversalCityFL]

Horribly designed from a sales and profit pov?

Everybody is a certain degree of correct here. Some stores are very profitable, but also, CW is horribly designed.

Personally, I feel they did the best they could with the land they had. But, CW has been plagued with traffic problems since it has opened. The two main issues are 1) the second level and 2) the stairway shops.

The Second Level
The second level (I believe it's called the promenade level -- where the groove/Bob Marley is) is virtually hidden from the tourist's view. Over the past decade, Universal has made every attempt to communicate that there is a second level of entertainment up there -- installing escalators to suck people up there, and even resorting to installing signs that literally have huge neon flashing arrows. They have also added an overhead truss with party lighting to give it some excitement up there.

The Stairway Shops
These have suffered from low traffic and high turnover over the years. The only visibility for these shops is when you exit USF, and quite frankly, nobody wants to walk up steep stairs after a long day at the parks. Also, the stairs look like they go to nowhere. Some spaces, like where Burger King now resides, have sat empty for a decade due to the traffic issues (and possibly high rent).


Side question: Anyone remember when E! was supposed to have a studio in CW?

 

[Nick]

From a design level, having a second level is actually making great use of the limited space they have for CityWalk.

However, from a business prospective, as Kuribo said, it's not a great design, as it's hard to get people to want to go up there or even know there is a second level. Things like the Starbucks, Moe's, Whopper Bar, Panda Express and the AMC exit on the second level help to attract people up there, but it still is a bad design from a BUSINESS perspective.

 

[natespf]

Is it just me, or wouldn't you think if they were going to have a detached 3rd gate they would also plan to have a 4th (or even 5th) gate on that land years down the pike? They know all about being boxed in, and not being able to expand. And I think this can be done with the land around Locheed Martin. They could have another larger City Walk like area, put a water park in both lands, and some more hotel space. Giving Universal a true week long experience.

If that was going to happen down the line, I would see the local government at least helping them get the land ready for a monorail. You could stay on-site in either land and just hop on over to the other land at any time. :drool:

 

[ReelJustice]

^Lets not get crazy now. A third gate is pushing it. A fourth gate is bad for business. A fifth gate would be a disaster. See: Walt Disney World. It's just not a sustainable business model. Americans don't get enough vacation days and the parks are just too hard to maintain/ keep fresh.

 

[natespf]

^Lets not get crazy now.

Hey the 5th gate was just dreaming at this point, but I do not think planning for a 4th gate is that crazy.