Wizarding World - Diagon Alley Discussion (Opens 2014)

[Felipe]

Well thank you, for sharing with us your enlightened scientific opinion. Those four words spell tell us just what we wanted to know.

:inquisitive:

Teebs...

So, about that track... If that stays the way it looks in that picture, meaning it does not go all the way to the other side of the street, I don't see how this is completely stable/safe. I might not remember a lot about physics, but just trying to use my common sense... Let's say these things got a huge concrete base/footer/whatever holding them in place. I see how this would prevent the whole structure from tipping over. Ok, that makes sense to me. But, what doesn't make sense to me is how can a footer prevent the weight of the trains from bending down the top part of that cantilever structure? I'm sure the trains are not light... I know there won't be a constant force pushing down on it, because the train is moving, but still there's gotta be a lot of stress put on that top part... That looks really unstable :look:

"Backstage" during HHN is actually considered "Onstage" while the event is going on. That's a real gray area though, but just thought you would want to know.

He means during the construction phase, when the event has not yet started.

 

[TylerDurden]

Teebs...

So, about that track... If that stays the way it looks in that picture, meaning it does not go all the way to the other side of the street, I don't see how this is completely stable/safe. I might not remember a lot about physics, but just trying to use my common sense... Let's say these things got a huge concrete base/footer/whatever holding them in place. I see how this would prevent the whole structure from tipping over. Ok, that makes sense to me. But, what doesn't make sense to me is how can a footer prevent the weight of the trains from bending down the top part of that cantilever structure? I'm sure the trains are not light... I know there won't be a constant force pushing down on it, because the train is moving, but still there's gotta be a lot of stress put on that top part... That looks really unstable :look:

I'm pretty sure the world-class engineers who have designed this, and countless other safe, reliable, and cutting edge projects have got it better figured out than you don't worry

 

[Hockeyman55]

Teebs...

So, about that track... If that stays the way it looks in that picture, meaning it does not go all the way to the other side of the street, I don't see how this is completely stable/safe. I might not remember a lot about physics, but just trying to use my common sense... Let's say these things got a huge concrete base/footer/whatever holding them in place. I see how this would prevent the whole structure from tipping over. Ok, that makes sense to me. But, what doesn't make sense to me is how can a footer prevent the weight of the trains from bending down the top part of that cantilever structure? I'm sure the trains are not light... I know there won't be a constant force pushing down on it, because the train is moving, but still there's gotta be a lot of stress put on that top part... That looks really unstable :look:




He means during the construction phase, when the event has not yet started.

I thought the same exact thing. Ive seen pics where the track looks even further way from the supports and just boggles me how it will support all that weight.

 

[natespf]

I'm pretty sure the world-class engineers who have designed this...

Yes, they are big thick metal beams. And the shape is what gives them more strength than just a flat piece of metal. Besides that the support towers are fairly close together, so no one beam would take the full weight of a train. The key is to have it at least a little stronger than needed, and I think that is what they will have once it is done. That is assuming they got the footers right underground, but hey it is a high profile venue that is going through permits/inspections :thumbs:

 

[Felipe]

I'm pretty sure the world-class engineers who have designed this, and countless other safe, reliable, and cutting edge projects have got it better figured out than you don't worry

Nah... reelly? Buts... I is so smrt like... a geenius and like the smartetest then a lot of peeple! :bonk:

And yet, there are still plenty of attractions out there with engineering issues... A certain glaring red example comes to mind...

 

[natespf]

Nah... reelly? Buts... I is so smrt like... a geenius and like the smartetest then a lot of peeple! :bonk:

And yet, there are still plenty of attractions out there with engineering issues... A certain glaring red example comes to mind...

The physics of a roller coaster train is more complicated. Something that I forgot to mention is the way they have the supports the tracks would go on top of add more strength to the structure as well. I'll wait an see how the track building pans out too.

One of my concerns is there being 2 trains and the areas where there is only one track. If for any reason one train gets delayed, the other train would be forced to delay as well. Or if one train breaks down they may need to shut down the whole ride for who knows how long.

 

[TylerDurden]

Nah... reelly? Buts... I is so smrt like... a geenius and like the smartetest then a lot of peeple! :bonk:

And yet, there are still plenty of attractions out there with engineering issues... A certain glaring red example comes to mind...

yeah but the HRRR's issues don't involve the track not being supported and completely collapsing! I'm pretty sure if there was a legitimate problem then the engineers would know how to handle it. Plus, when a ride has issues, it's not like they were glaring enough that posters on a discussion board called it right away and condemned it. I think they know what they're doing. :thumbs:

 

[Teebin]

One of my concerns is there being 2 trains and the areas where there is only one track. If for any reason one train gets delayed, the other train would be forced to delay as well. Or if one train breaks down they may need to shut down the whole ride for who knows how long.

I would expect that they have a little tug-car that can move a train out of the way quickly. It will be a mess for a while if/when it happens however.

 

[JungleSkip]

Teebs...

So, about that track... If that stays the way it looks in that picture, meaning it does not go all the way to the other side of the street, I don't see how this is completely stable/safe. I might not remember a lot about physics, but just trying to use my common sense... Let's say these things got a huge concrete base/footer/whatever holding them in place. I see how this would prevent the whole structure from tipping over. Ok, that makes sense to me. But, what doesn't make sense to me is how can a footer prevent the weight of the trains from bending down the top part of that cantilever structure? I'm sure the trains are not light... I know there won't be a constant force pushing down on it, because the train is moving, but still there's gotta be a lot of stress put on that top part... That looks really unstable :look:

It's all in the type of steel they used. As long as the steel they picked can withstand the bending force the weight of the trains will put on it, there's nothing to worry about. And there's absolutely no reason to think they haven't.

 

[Felipe]

An (engineering) issue, is an issue, is an issue... Rockit is just one example. My point is issues, miscalculations, or even errors during construction, etc. can happen, especially on unprecedented rides.

Yes, they are big thick metal beams. And the shape is what gives them more strength than just a flat piece of metal. Besides that the support towers are fairly close together, so no one beam would take the full weight of a train. The key is to have it at least a little stronger than needed, and I think that is what they will have once it is done. That is assuming they got the footers right underground, but hey it is a high profile venue that is going through permits/inspections :thumbs:

It's all in the type of steel they used. As long as the steel they picked can withstand the bending force the weight of the trains will put on it, there's nothing to worry about. And there's absolutely no reason to think they haven't.

These points make sense. Thanks for the informative, constructive responses :thumbs:

 

[USO92]

Anybody else think that the track looks like a large ladder?

Or is it just me?

 

[Hockeyman55]

An (engineering) issue, is an issue, is an issue... Rockit is just one example. My point is issues, miscalculations, or even errors during construction, etc. can happen, especially on unprecedented rides.





These points make sense. Thanks for the informative, constructive responses :thumbs:

Yeti . . . cough . . . cough . . .

 

[TylerDurden]

An (engineering) issue, is an issue, is an issue... Rockit is just one example. My point is issues, miscalculations, or even errors during construction, etc. can happen, especially on unprecedented rides.





These points make sense. Thanks for the informative, constructive responses :thumbs:

I have yet to see the day when a project is completely re-done because someone on a discussion board said it looks like it might tip over

 

[Marni1971]

After my request and satisfaction yesterday, I must say that the backstage track engineering seems to defy physics. It will amount to 1 1/2 trains being cantilevered over the service road! The first thing that came to mind is the Yeti's problems... :blank:

Google The Hilton or Beetham Tower, Manchester UK to see how big heavy things can be balanced

 

[Disneyhead]

Most engineering issues happen from things the engineers didn't see when designing something. Like on HRRR, the excessive torque on the trains causing irregular wheel wear.

Something as glaring as this design, I am sure, has been engineered to the max.

 

[blue180]

Hmmmm....It is weird how it like "hangs" over, without like a support.....

 

[cbconglom]

Anybody else think that the track looks like a large ladder?

Or is it just me?

Right there with you.. And the photo must be misleading because to me it looks like it would support the sues trolley more then it would the size and weight of a train

 

[SkiBum]

Also, walk on the Grand Canyon Skywalk. Cantilevered structures tend to be very stong, so long as they are built/engineered correctly.

 

[TylerDurden]

Most engineering issues happen from things the engineers didn't see when designing something. Like on HRRR, the excessive torque on the trains causing irregular wheel wear.

Something as glaring as this design, I am sure, has been engineered to the max.

exactly. If there was a glaring mistake on a blueprint and design they themselves created, I think they'd know about it

 

[vacoaster]

I'm pretty sure they have done the stress calculations, analyzed the truss to the nth degree. I mean I think a simple Free Body Diagram will show the cantilever is safe. There's alot of factors in structures that are in play here. From the strength of the material which withstand alot more force that one may think, to the bolts holding the structure in place. Basically for engineers this is big statics topic (calculating moments so the sum is zero...etc..)