Avengers Campus (DCA)

[biggerboat16]

I think the problem with Avengers and SWGE is they lack soul. SWGE based on the size of the land, Avengers based on the esthetic.

GE itself is a very impressive land physically when it comes to size, buildings, rock-work, etc, but it is very hollow because Disney has neglected to fill it with any heart or substance. Just some droids and walk-around characters would do wonders. A shift to the OT era would also allow more characters to be present as it can cover some prequel content as well like Maul.

Avengers campus has exactly the opposite issue. It has lots of characters and kinetic excitement but the physical land itself is below subpar. Boring architecture, it’s small, no worthwhile rides IMO. With GE, they took what was built to be a strong land and refused to fill it with any of the extras that give it substance. With AC, they took a subpar, under-built land and flooded it with the ‘extras,’ seemingly thinking that’s what would save the land.

AC is built like an ice cream sundae with a spoonful of ice cream and 5 gallons of whipped cream.

 

[Nico]

GE itself is a very impressive land physically when it comes to size, buildings, rock-work, etc, but it is very hollow because Disney has neglected to fill it with any heart or substance. Just some droids and walk-around characters would do wonders. A shift to the OT era would also allow more characters to be present as it can cover some prequel content as well like Maul.

Avengers campus has exactly the opposite issue. It has lots of characters and kinetic excitement but the physical land itself is below subpar. Boring architecture, it’s small, no worthwhile rides IMO. With GE, they took what was built to be a strong land and refused to fill it with any of the extras that give it substance. With AC, they took a subpar, under-built land and flooded it with the ‘extras,’ seemingly thinking that’s what would save the land.

AC is built like an ice cream sundae with a spoonful of ice cream and 5 gallons of whipped cream.

Agreed! My exact thoughts.

 

[JungleSkip]

The only thing I would say is that Marvel and Star Wars should have been bulletproof except that Disney took the jackets off. By ignoring fans (who make the subject popular), they ignored the strengths of both franchises.

Completely, absolutely disagree. The problem with both franchises is they're absolutely terrified to do anything out of the ordinary, for the most part. The only good things Disney has produced from Star Wars (Rogue One, Last Jedi, Andor) are wild swings different from what "the fans" would want.

Ignoring "the fans" is always the best possible course of action

 

[OrlandoGuy]

GE itself is a very impressive land physically when it comes to size, buildings, rock-work, etc, but it is very hollow because Disney has neglected to fill it with any heart or substance. Just some droids and walk-around characters would do wonders. A shift to the OT era would also allow more characters to be present as it can cover some prequel content as well like Maul.

Avengers campus has exactly the opposite issue. It has lots of characters and kinetic excitement but the physical land itself is below subpar. Boring architecture, it’s small, no worthwhile rides IMO. With GE, they took what was built to be a strong land and refused to fill it with any of the extras that give it substance. With AC, they took a subpar, under-built land and flooded it with the ‘extras,’ seemingly thinking that’s what would save the land.

AC is built like an ice cream sundae with a spoonful of ice cream and 5 gallons of whipped cream.

Agreed on Star Wars—it’s detailed to a fault, and while it’s objectively impressive it’s not fun. The land suffers from everything that’s burdened Star Wars since the prequels started coming out…it’s overly serious and doesn’t have any of the campiness that makes the originals work.

I will say (having not been) that Avengers Campus looks like it may solve that problem. It has fun elements that don’t take themselves overly seriously (huge pretzels, fun photo ops, the Spiderman figure are what should make up a good theme park land)…but it’s missing the ride.

I have to wonder if there’s a hesitancy to fund a ride because the characters have become so tied to the (highly paid) actors who played them. I get that, from a financial standpoint, Disney may be worried about pulling the trigger on another mega-ride, but by all accounts Universal had plenty of opportunity to do the same but shelved plans in favor of IP like (checks notes)…Kong…and Jimmy Fallon..?

Even on the Disney ships, they built an “attraction” in a Marvel restaurant…and it’s built around Ant Man. It just makes no sense to me how badly both companies have bungled Marvel properties at the height of their popularity.

 

[ReelJustice]

Avengers Campus is fine for what it is. The character meet and greets are the highlight. I think the biggest selling point of the land is its simplicity compared to recent offerings. The meet and greets provide reasons for repeat visits, and the Pym Test Kitchen has good food.

That being said, DCA desperately needs more attractions.

 

[Jamesh22]

As some others have said, this generation of Imagineers seem to have a bad habit of overthinking their creations. Perhaps it's professional arrogance, too techie oriented, and a lack of common sense. They just don't seem to have a good feel for what's important/interesting to the common guest. They may need to start spending more time in the parks, and less time in offices isolated from the parks.

Possibly that or could it be Management intervention?

Rise is the best attraction at Disneyland and have heard great things about Mickey & Minnie. Mission Breakout was an incredibly successful retheme which has improved on the original ride (and I was against it). The GP LOVE it, possibly because it has heart and soul unlike the rest of Avengers Campus.

That said, wasn't the original Imagineering pitch for GE a spinner and a shop? Thats not a lack of common sense it's a total lack of ambition.

 

[Mad Dog]

Possibly that or could it be Management intervention?

Rise is the best attraction at Disneyland and have heard great things about Mickey & Minnie. Mission Breakout was an incredibly successful retheme which has improved on the original ride (and I was against it). The GP LOVE it, possibly because it has heart and soul unlike the rest of Avengers Campus.

That said, wasn't the original Imagineering pitch for GE a spinner and a shop? Thats not a lack of common sense it's a total lack of ambition.

Rumored , yes. Until the Disney Board toured Diagon's opening, was wowed by it, and told the Imagineers to come up with something better than their plans. Imagineers seem to do OK on attractions, but just don't have the knack to do a Potter level land. Their immersive lands are OK, but fall short of Universal's Potter accomplishments. They just can't seem to put the whole package together.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

I don't disagree that sometimes the Imagineers spend too much time (and money) on story/authenticity, but a lot of it is really just management to blame. SWGE, pre-Chapek, failed by setting expectations too high before Chapek began his cutting rampage.

One of the downfalls of Imagineering is that they can create, albeit awesome, effects that break down easily due to lack of maintenance and are only seen for a few seconds (robot Spider-man from AC).

Avengers Campus smells of corporate folks realizing they could spend 1/4 of the cost of SWGE/Pandora, slap a logo on a building, and make just as much merch as a fully-themed land that cost a billion or so.

Give Imagineering their space and a decent budget, and we can get great things out of them.

 

[Jake S]

Give Imagineering their space and a decent budget, and we can get great things out of them.

I agree with this. I haven't been in a themed environment that tops Diagon Alley, but Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge, Pandora and Cars Land are all very, very good, in my opinion. not perfect! but I have little doubt that if Imagineering was given a wider berth for Avengers Campus, we'd see something more impressive.

 

[JungleSkip]

I agree with this. I haven't been in a themed environment that tops Diagon Alley, but Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge, Pandora and Cars Land are all very, very good, in my opinion. not perfect! but I have little doubt that if Imagineering was given a wider berth for Avengers Campus, we'd see something more impressive.

All those lands are good, but they're also just monstrously expensive and took forever to be built compared to how the competition does it.

I love Disney and WDI, but the company needs to figure out how to be leaner and quicker with theme park additions.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

All those lands are good, but they're also just monstrously expensive and took forever to be built compared to how the competition does it.

I love Disney and WDI, but the company needs to figure out how to be leaner and quicker with theme park additions.

Yeah, I think WDI also suffers from trying to be too ambitious for every single project, no matter the scale, when a simple flat ride is all we need and a smaller dark ride or two. There was no need for them to do a Mary Poppins C-Ticket with an E-ticket budget.

I also selfishly liked the idea of them moving to Florida only because they would have built attractions with WDW in mind and more shade. (Tho UC doesn't seem to care either so who knows lol)

 

[JungleSkip]

Yeah, I think WDI also suffers from trying to be too ambitious for every single project, no matter the scale, when a simple flat ride is all we need and a smaller dark ride or two. There was no need for them to do a Mary Poppins C-Ticket with an E-ticket budget.

They want the old "No one can touch us!" mentality, which when it works is great! Rise is an achievement!

The problem is when it doesn't work completely, you've just spend 5 years building a glorified splash pad in the middle of Epcot while Universal is going to build something of similar size, scope, and function in like 12 months.

Their mentality keeps the parks from meeting guest demand. Like you said, sometimes we need a few flat rides or a roller coaster instead of a billion dollar, genre defining dark ride

 

[Jerroddragon]

If Spiderman was even the same ride system but had Villains and Dr Strange got more space and could use tech similar to Bourne Stunt show (mainly saying use a screen as the background)

I think the land would feel better. The Spiderman show and Aveneger Stunt show could be more but for a show people just stand on a path for, I've always seen those busy so can't really complain.

But Spiderman is such a let down and the Strange show just wasn't given the budget to be anything that big, but if they could given Strange more room by taking one of the shops away then I think the land while theming wise would still be meh. At least the land would have a fun Spiderman ride, a cool Strange show and characters to fill out the rest of the land.

 

[pumpkinbot343]

I don't think you're ever seeing the ride, tbh

Honestly who knows if the ride would even be considered good by then.

At this point, it's funny how Marvel Super Hero Island has more soul overall than Avengers Campus for a land built 25 years ago.

Helps that it’s based on the comic books. Sure those have their own sets of problems but those stories can last forever, whereas people have been questioning the MCU’s quality for quite some time now.

And IDK care what everyone says, the aesthetic of MSHI is just kick-arse. Being more modern and less dated is not always a good thing.

 

[JungleSkip]

And IDK care what everyone says, the aesthetic of MSHI is just kick-arse. Being more modern and less dated is not always a good thing.

I have my qualms with MSHI's aesthetic (the big cardboard cutouts are just not good looking IMO), but I would take it any day of the week over the corporate business park look of AC

 

[deadbydawn]

Even on the Disney ships, they built an “attraction” in a Marvel restaurant…and it’s built around Ant Man. It just makes no sense to me how badly both companies have bungled Marvel properties at the height of their popularity.

FWIW, I think they always go with Ant-Man for the food related stuff because they can do "Instagramable" size related things. As a fan of Paul Rudd, I am not complaining!

 

[Mad Dog]

Budget a problem? Imagineers have a history of huge bloated budgets for attractions/lands/etc. Money's not the problem. It's the way they spend it. Disney doesn't get much bang for it's buck. There must be a culture/bureaucratic problem. They've changed the top guys, but the same issues continue. And they do seem to have a certain arrogance.

 

[Wigglepebbles]

they’re taking months to build a Meet n’ Greet retheme to a hugely popular character, and couldn’t even add an animatronic during a refurbishment…

 

[UniversalRBLX]

Budget a problem? Imagineers have a history of huge bloated budgets for attractions/lands/etc. Money's not the problem. It's the way they spend it. Disney doesn't get much bang for it's buck. There must be a culture/bureaucratic problem. They've changed the top guys, but the same issues continue. And they do seem to have a certain arrogance.

Hey, they need time to figure out how important the type of floor used is to the guest experience!

 

[GA-MBIT]

Hey, def off topic for the thread, but I feel appropriate for the conversation, did they ever do that Figment Meet & Greet from D23 last year? Yknow, the one announcement they made for the future of the parks? It's been a little bit, huh?

Something needs to change. There is a ridiculous problem when even cynical, thrown together, small placeholder additions are taking over a year to be installed. Unless they start breaking ground today, we will not see a Rise-style Infinity War ride be opened until we are brushing the 2030's. How is a company so mismanaged that it lets an incredible opportunity like that just melt away in their hands? At this point, I'm on the side of "It's too late." and frankly maybe it's for the best that they aren't doubling down on the MCU with how much it's been floundering since Disney+ and Feige's absence as a micromanager. What an absolute shame. Probably one of the larger missed opportunities for a theme park E-Ticket next to Spongebob and I'm sure quite a few others.