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The Official "Use of Screenz" Thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter Brian G.
  • Start date Start date Jul 13, 2015
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Scott W.

Scott W.

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #341
AR could be an interesting turn to the screenz debate but I'm curious to see how they would implement it and if it would lead to some lazy development.
 
IAmFloridaBorn

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #342
Is there any example of AR currently being used?
 
Teebin

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #343
IAmFloridaBorn said:
Is there any example of AR currently being used?
Click to expand...

I don't believe so. They still have a hard time using it in-house. This is why the promos use cgi overlays constantly. It is still a bit of a theory still.
 
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IAmFloridaBorn

IAmFloridaBorn

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #344
Teebin said:
I don't believe so.
Click to expand...
If not then we,well Comcast should benefit greatly if successfully pulled off.
 
quinnmac000

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #345
IAmFloridaBorn said:
Is there any example of AR currently being used?
Click to expand...

Yes actually...ironically in Japan at USJ. The Yo-kai Watch 2 temporary attraction uses AR technology to recreate the game.

They actually been attempting AR in the park since 2012 with their park app having AR camera to create videos of persons with different characters.
 
Last edited: Jun 18, 2016
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Teebin

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #346
quinnmac000 said:
Yes actually...
Click to expand...

Wild, those damn Japanese! ;)
 
Viator

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #347
Teebin said:
Wild, those damn Japanese!
Click to expand...

To be fair, isn't Japan a technological marvel in the products they sometimes sell?
 
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IAmFloridaBorn

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  • Jun 18, 2016
  • #348
Alexshow said:
To be fair, isn't Japan a technological marvel in the products they sometimes sell?
Click to expand...
Unfortunately.
 
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boomerthom

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  • #349
Screens as a tool are perfectly alright with me, as (and this has been noted numerous times) they're useful for integrating elements that can't be done with practical effects (characters moving through an environment, etc). However, what I'd really like to see is a return to the use of screens as an augmentation for a consistent ride experience. What I mean by that is recently, attractions such as Gringotts and Kong have gotten into a habit of pacing their experiences as "stop and watch a screen for a while-> transition->repeat". You pull into the Thief's Downfall scene on Gringotts, sit there for a while and watch a film, and finally transition into the freefall scene where the pacing repeats itself.

Now take Spider-Man, which I'd argue consistently feels like a ride. For example, we don't stop in front of the villains' warehouse screen for an extended period of time to watch a film play out - instead, we slowly creep up to it while its animation plays, then pull away as the animation finishes. We strafe past the Spidey back alley and tank scenes. We back away from Doc Ock and Hobgoblin's scenes. And so on. We're nearly always moving. The moments where the ride ceases most movement, such as the Hydro Man scene, are short lived compared to any of the screen scenes on Kong. The entire time, Spidey feels like a consistent ride experience rather than "ride for a bit, then watch a film for a bit, then ride some more until the next film". Spidey is infinitely re-rideable for me as a result because, even ignoring the screens, like 90+% of the ride involves fun motion, whereas maybe half of Gringotts is simply sitting stationary watching screens animate, so lot of the ride is waiting for that next burst of motion. A screen experience in isolation can lose its appeal quickly (since you already know what happens), but motion is continually enjoyable to me.

Transformers and FJ are similar to Spidey, but instead of lateral motion they focus on breakneck simulation. Even two transformers fighting impacts our vehicle with a simulated vibration occurring when Optimus punches Megatron. On both rides there's always something to experience beyond what's happening on the screen. So a bit different than Spidey, but still consistently paced with the use of simulated motion.

Obviously there are exceptions. The freefall scene in Gringotts is very well executed, and the type of interaction I want RVs to have with screens. Kong's 360 scene is also pulled off well due to the unexpectedly realistic simulation, though the vast majority of time spent watching screens in both of those rides are lacking in that level of physical sensation. I just want to see these types of elements implemented on a more consistent basis throughout rides.

So yeah, totally down with screens and all, but now that Universal has had their fun with Kong and Gringotts I want to see screens be used to add further sensory overload to a motion experience. Gringotts' style of pacing, if nothing else, is unique, but with two in a row (and possibly a third coming with F&F), I'm starting to get a bit worried.

Edit - made some additions.
 
Last edited: Jun 18, 2016
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belloq87

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #350
ChrisFL said:
More SCREENZ thoughts.

After hearing about some people who rode Kong and for a few seconds thought the 3D bats were real (not the AA's), does anyone believe that screen quality and 3D will ever become good enough to be practically indistinguishable from real sets? I know when I first rode Gringott's, I saw the tracks in 3D above (I know there's actual tracks in a different scene that are props), and thought they were real tracks for a few seconds.
Click to expand...
The answer to that question is maybe, but I think we're a long way off from that. At least for me. The subtle difference in lighting on the real set vs. the light levels coming from the screen are usually a big tip-off for me. There's often almost a kind of faint glow coming from the screens (which makes sense given than it's a projection on a screen). Some people might be more attuned to that than others.

Another factor is the quality of the CGI animation present on the screen. It takes some mighty impressive work to fool me (Davy Jones was the last digital creation to fake me out in a movie; I would have bet any money I was looking at prosthetics and makeup). Backgrounds and set extensions might be a different story (Pixar's environments have become basically photoreal in things like THE GOOD DINOSAUR), but once creature animation becomes more consistently photorealistic, that's one less hindrance to screens and ride film being fully immersive.

hatetofly said:
Fast and Furious will be the breaking point for screen heavy attractions at Universal Studios
Click to expand...

“Breaking point” meaning that Universal might become aware of the screen-heavy perception of USF in some people’s minds, and might work to start to rectify that? Can we expect that scale to eventually start to tip back in the other direction? Will Nintendo be the first step towards that?

boomerthom said:
Screens as a tool are perfectly alright with me, as (and this has been noted numerous times) they're useful for integrating elements that can't be done with practical effects (characters moving through an environment, etc). However, what I'd really like to see is a return to the use of screens as an augmentation for a consistent ride experience. What I mean by that is recently, attractions such as Gringotts and Kong have gotten into a habit of pacing their experiences as "stop and watch a screen for a while-> transition->repeat". You pull into the Thief's Downfall scene on Gringotts, sit there for a while and watch a film, and finally transition into the freefall scene where the pacing repeats itself.

Now take Spider-Man, which I'd argue consistently feels like a ride. For example, we don't stop in front of the villains' warehouse screen for an extended period of time to watch a film play out - instead, we slowly creep up to it while its animation plays, then pull away as the animation finishes. We strafe past the Spidey back alley and tank scenes. We back away from Doc Ock and Hobgoblin's scenes. And so on. We're nearly always moving. The moments where the ride ceases most movement, such as the Hydro Man scene, are short lived compared to any of the screen scenes on Kong. The entire time, Spidey feels like a consistent ride experience rather than "ride for a bit, then watch a film for a bit, then ride some more until the next film". Spidey is infinitely re-rideable for me as a result because, even ignoring the screens, like 90+% of the ride involves fun motion, whereas maybe half of Gringotts is simply sitting stationary watching screens animate, so lot of the ride is waiting for that next burst of motion. A screen experience in isolation can lose its appeal quickly (since you already know what happens), but motion is continually enjoyable to me.

Transformers and FJ are similar to Spidey, but instead of lateral motion they focus on breakneck simulation. Even two transformers fighting impacts our vehicle with a simulated vibration occurring when Optimus punches Megatron. On both rides there's always something to experience beyond what's happening on the screen. So a bit different than Spidey, but still consistently paced with the use of simulated motion.
Click to expand...

Your whole post is excellent, but these sections in particular really illustrate what is brilliant about Spider-Man, why I don't think it has yet been topped (by anybody), and why Gringotts feels a little like a step-sideways to me. In terms of its screen usage and integration, at least.
 
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ChrisFL

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #351
boomerthom said:
Now take Spider-Man, which I'd argue consistently feels like a ride. For example, we don't stop in front of the villains' warehouse screen for an extended period of time to watch a film play out - instead, we slowly creep up to it while its animation plays, then pull away as the animation finishes. We strafe past the Spidey back alley and tank scenes. We back away from Doc Ock and Hobgoblin's scenes. And so on. We're nearly always moving. The moments where the ride ceases most movement, such as the Hydro Man scene, are short lived compared to any of the screen scenes on Kong. The entire time, Spidey feels like a consistent ride experience rather than "ride for a bit, then watch a film for a bit, then ride some more until the next film". Spidey is infinitely re-rideable for me as a result because, even ignoring the screens, like 90+% of the ride involves fun motion, whereas maybe half of Gringotts is simply sitting stationary watching screens animate, so lot of the ride is waiting for that next burst of motion. A screen experience in isolation can lose its appeal quickly (since you already know what happens), but motion is continually enjoyable to me.

Transformers and FJ are similar to Spidey, but instead of lateral motion they focus on breakneck simulation. Even two transformers fighting impacts our vehicle with a simulated vibration occurring when Optimus punches Megatron. On both rides there's always something to experience beyond what's happening on the screen. So a bit different than Spidey, but still consistently paced with the use of simulated motion.

Obviously there are exceptions. The freefall scene in Gringotts is very well executed, and the type of interaction I want RVs to have with screens. Kong's 360 scene is also pulled off well due to the unexpectedly realistic simulation, though the vast majority of time spent watching screens in both of those rides are lacking in that level of physical sensation. I just want to see these types of elements implemented on a more consistent basis throughout rides.
Click to expand...

Agreed 100% with this and the new upgraded Spiderman CG makes it even more immersive.

I would also add that, for those who have watched SDL's POTC video (and if you haven't, you NEED TO)...we're seeing what can be done with more integration of live sets and screens in new and creative ways.

Someone said that this ride is Disney's first that's FINALLY on-par with Spiderman and I'd have to agree from what I've seen so far, it only took Disney 17 years and you have to go to China.
 
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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #352
belloq87 said:
Your whole post is excellent, but these sections in particular really illustrate what is brilliant about Spider-Man, why I don't think it has yet been topped (by anybody), and why Gringotts feels a little like a step-sideways to me. In terms of its screen usage and integration, at least.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Spidey is going to be very difficult to top for me because of it's sheer variety of elements, how seamlessly each element blends into the others, and the buttery smooth pacing throughout. FJ does comes close for me - it's similarly paced well with interesting motion occurring regardless if the RV is in front of a screen or not, though it doesn't quite match Spidey's seamlessness; the transitions between screen and set are pretty visually jarring imo. But at least they don't feel jarring in their overall experience like Gringotts. Then again, the Kukas are still unlike pretty much anything else out there, so it's tough to call. Both are fantastic attractions.

ChrisFL said:
Agreed 100% with this and the new upgraded Spiderman CG makes it even more immersive.

I would also add that, for those who have watched SDL's POTC video (and if you haven't, you NEED TO)...we're seeing what can be done with more integration of live sets and screens in new and creative ways.

Someone said that this ride is Disney's first that's FINALLY on-par with Spiderman and I'd have to agree from what I've seen so far, it only took Disney 17 years and you have to go to China.
Click to expand...

The pacing of Shanghai's Pirates is exactly what I want to see more of, particularly from Universal. There are plenty of screens, but they're used appropriately (blended with sets to provide impossibly-large and complex backdrops, musion for dynamic characters, etc), and the ride is always moving forward. At least from what I can tell from POVs, the ride never makes you take a time out and watch a quick film before getting back to the action. It looks like a consistent ride, rather than a blending of a ride and a film that risks being jarring as the experience swings back and forth between each style.
 
Last edited: Jun 19, 2016
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belloq87

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #353
boomerthom said:
Yeah, Spidey is going to be very difficult to top for me because of it's sheer variety of elements, how seamlessly each element blends into the others, and the buttery smooth pacing throughout.
Click to expand...
Absolutely. Spider-Man has what is still my favorite moment in any theme park attraction ever, and neither Universal nor Disney has been able to top it: the Hobgoblin scene, where he throws a pumpkin bomb on a screen, which explodes on the real set as we whirl away. I get goosebumps just thinking about it, and nothing in Transformers or Gringotts comes close to that level of integration - and interaction - between the action on the screen and the action in the real environment.
 
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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #354
belloq87 said:
Absolutely. Spider-Man has what is still my favorite moment in any theme park attraction ever, and neither Universal nor Disney has been able to top it: the Hobgoblin scene, where he throws a pumpkin bomb on a screen, which explodes on the real set as we whirl away. I get goosebumps just thinking about it, and nothing in Transformers or Gringotts comes close to that level of integration - and interaction - between the action on the screen and the action in the real environment.
Click to expand...
Spider-Man just holds up so well. The first three or four times I rode Transformers, I actually temporarily thought it was better than Spider-Man because you are immersed in the screens so much, like you're right in the middle of the action. But after lots of repeat viewings, Transformers kept falling on my personal attraction rank (now it's down to 6 at Orlando Universal). It's just nowhere near as full an experience as SpiderMan. SpiderMan is #2, behind FJ, on my best attraction list, primarily because it's queue is nowhere near FJ's level, and I give a lot of weight to queues & preshows in my rankings.
 
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belloq87

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #355
Mad Dog said:
Spider-Man just holds up so well. The first three or four times I rode Transformers, I actually temporarily thought it was better than Spider-Man because you are immersed in the screens so much, like you're right in the middle of the action. But after lots of repeat viewings, Transformers kept falling on my personal attraction rank (now it's down to 6 at Orlando Universal). It's just nowhere near as full an experience as SpiderMan. SpiderMan is #2, behind FJ, on my best attraction list, primarily because it's queue is nowhere near FJ's level, and I give a lot of weight to queues & preshows in my rankings.
Click to expand...

Forbidden Journey gets close to Spidey for me, especially because of the queue (which, for me, is the best queue in Orlando), but Spidey is still my reigning favorite.

Gringotts would probably just barely make my Top 10. Transformers would... not. I mean, I think it's fun, and I'm glad it adds to the ride count at USF, but it doesn't give me anything that I can't already get from a couple other attractions at the parks.
 
Mad Dog

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #356
belloq87 said:
Forbidden Journey gets close to Spidey for me, especially because of the queue (which, for me, is the best queue in Orlando), but Spidey is still my reigning favorite.

Gringotts would probably just barely make my Top 10. Transformers would... not. I mean, I think it's fun, and I'm glad it adds to the ride count at USF, but it doesn't give me anything that I can't already get from a couple other attractions at the parks.
Click to expand...
Are your rankings for all of Orlando or just Universal?
 
belloq87

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  • Jun 19, 2016
  • #357
Mad Dog said:
Are your rankings for all of Orlando or just Universal?
Click to expand...

Just Universal!

Here are my Top 10 Favorite Attractions at Universal (including rides and shows):
1. The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man
2. Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey
3. Revenge of the Mummy
4. Men in Black: Alien Attack
5. Jurassic Park River Adventure
6. E.T. Adventure
7. Universal Horror Makeup Show
8. T2: 3D
9. Harry Potter and the Escape from Gringotts
10. Poseidon’s Fury (Yes, really!)

For the sake of completeness, here are my Top 10 Favorite Attractions in Orlando:
1. The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man
2. Haunted Mansion
3. Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey
4. Spaceship Earth
5. Twilight Zone Tower of Terror
6. Splash Mountain
7. Pirates of the Caribbean
8. Revenge of the Mummy
9. The Great Movie Ride
10. The American Adventure
 
misterID

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  • #358
belloq87 said:
9. Harry Potter and the Escape from Gringotts
Click to expand...
:jaw:

That's like in my all time top 5 attractions including Disney. My only complaint is the coaster section should be longer.
 
belloq87

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  • #359
misterID said:
:jaw:

That's like in my all time top 5 attractions including Disney. My only complaint is the coaster section should be longer.
Click to expand...

Yep, I know I'm in the minority on this one!
 
Mad Dog

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belloq87 said:
Just Universal!

Here are my Top 10 Favorite Attractions at Universal (including rides and shows):
1. The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man
2. Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey
3. Revenge of the Mummy
4. Men in Black: Alien Attack
5. Jurassic Park River Adventure
6. E.T. Adventure
7. Universal Horror Makeup Show
8. T2: 3D
9. Harry Potter and the Escape from Gringotts
10. Poseidon’s Fury (Yes, really!)

For the sake of completeness, here are my Top 10 Favorite Attractions in Orlando:
1. The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man
2. Haunted Mansion
3. Harry Potter and the Forbidden Journey
4. Spaceship Earth
5. Twilight Zone Tower of Terror
6. Splash Mountain
7. Pirates of the Caribbean
8. Revenge of the Mummy
9. The Great Movie Ride
10. The American Adventure
Click to expand...
Interesting list. I like Poseidon's Fury also. Probably one of the best facades in existence. Nice queue. The show is fun if the guide is good. Water vortex is amazing.
 
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