Future of Toon Lagoon

[OrlandoGuy]

So in reading a thread on this new, terrible Popeye game I found out the copyright for the characters is up in 2024. I wonder if anything will happen to the ride/section of the park or could it seal the deal to keep it longer? Some food for thought.

Is anyone really pining for the rights to Popeye? Seems like an easy (and inexpensive) contract renewal to me :shrug:

 

[Parkscope Joe]

Is anyone really pining for the rights to Popeye? Seems like an easy (and inexpensive) contract renewal to me :shrug:

That's not what I mean, I mean the copyright is gone in 2024, it's in the public domain. There *is no* contract after then.

 

[Jushin Thunder Liger]

So in reading a thread on this new, terrible Popeye game I found out the copyright for the characters is up in 2024. I wonder if anything will happen to the ride/section of the park or could it seal the deal to keep it longer? Some food for thought.

Did a quick dive into this, as Popeye’s copyrights are public domain in Europe: the Popeye “universe”, as it were, is considered a work for hire, and thus, Hearst is able to somewhat control how exactly Popeye exists in the public domain worldwide.

Modern problems call for modern solutions, which is where trademarks come in. In this way, Hearst is able to trademark the character designs and ensure that they’re the only ones who can still make the “real” Popeye stuff - forever and ever, Amen.

Not to mention, there’s other stuff in the land that belongs to Hearst - Hagar, Phantom, Flash Gordon - and for whatever it’s worth, remember our homie Little Nemo? “Oh, I’m falling out of bed”? He’s public domain, too.

 

[Coolbfitz]

I don't think Popeye is going away anytime soon.

In other Popeye news, the "spinach fountain" towards the end of the ride is working again.

 

[natespf]

Though the story of Frankenstein has been in public domain for a long time, the look of the "Universal Monster" is protected by trademark.

Also it's not uncommon for large media companies to have a license agreement even when they may not technically need one. Just paying the fee can be easier than the chance of needing to prove the don't need to in court. The large conglomerates keep up this charade of paying eachother back and forth, making it harder for new competition to come up.

 

[quinnmac000]

Did a quick dive into this, as Popeye’s copyrights are public domain in Europe: the Popeye “universe”, as it were, is considered a work for hire, and thus, Hearst is able to somewhat control how exactly Popeye exists in the public domain worldwide.

Modern problems call for modern solutions, which is where trademarks come in. In this way, Hearst is able to trademark the character designs and ensure that they’re the only ones who can still make the “real” Popeye stuff - forever and ever, Amen.

Not to mention, there’s other stuff in the land that belongs to Hearst - Hagar, Phantom, Flash Gordon - and for whatever it’s worth, remember our homie Little Nemo? “Oh, I’m falling out of bed”? He’s public domain, too.

Hagar and Flash are weird. Flash is rights are under both Disney/Universal, Hagar is under Universal via Classic Media.

 

[Jushin Thunder Liger]

Hagar and Flash are weird. Flash is rights are under both Disney/Universal, Hagar is under Universal via Classic Media.

Who told you that? That’s falsehood.

Flash and Hagar are both characters who are owned by Hearst; as early as this year, they’ve shown up in Hearst-sanctioned merchandise and media.

Flash Gordon, the movie, with Sam Jones and Max von Sydow, is a movie made and distributed by Universal whose score is owned by Disney…in the U.S. only. (This will be on the test.)

There was to be a new Flash movie by Taika Waititi, to be put out by Fox under Disney’s auspices, but The Mouse dropped it once the acquisition was final, so who knows if it’ll ever be out; it’s really inconsequential to Toon Lagoon, since no reference to either the earlier Flash movie or a hypothetical latter-day one within the land.

 

[SpyderDan]

This rights stuff is mindboggling lol.

 

[Jushin Thunder Liger]

This rights stuff is mindboggling lol.

It’s way easier to discuss/dissect with someone who’s not too into theme parks than the Marvel deal. All Universal did was enter into similar agreements with press syndicates with the rights to these characters - Universal Press Syndicate, United Features, King Features, Tribune, the Ward estate - and as previous changes and acquisitions went down within those companies, the contracts with each remained.

The only exceptions here are characters whose entertainment rights would have been held by a separate party at the time - Little Orphan Annie, Dick Tracy, Garfield, Peanuts - or whose creators may have taken issue with their characters being used - say, Calvin & Hobbes like usual.

 

[quinnmac000]

Who told you that? That’s falsehood.

Flash and Hagar are both characters who are owned by Hearst; as early as this year, they’ve shown up in Hearst-sanctioned merchandise and media.

Flash Gordon, the movie, with Sam Jones and Max von Sydow, is a movie made and distributed by Universal whose score is owned by Disney…in the U.S. only. (This will be on the test.)

There was to be a new Flash movie by Taika Waititi, to be put out by Fox under Disney’s auspices, but The Mouse dropped it once the acquisition was final, so who knows if it’ll ever be out; it’s really inconsequential to Toon Lagoon, since no reference to either the earlier Flash movie or a hypothetical latter-day one within the land.

Multiple people can own a character....Dreamworks/Mattel share ownership of She-ra.

At what point did you decide that Flash Gordon was next for the John Walsh treatment?

The Lost Movies was stories about films that we think we know but hadn’t been told. Titan are very good at making books on our favorite films – like Dark Crystal and Labyrinth – and those films which maybe we liked on VHS but weren’t successful when they came out theatrically. I was just thinking, gosh, no one has done a Flash Gordon book yet.


It took about eight months to get Universal Pictures and King Features, who were the rights holders for the Flash Gordon character, and Studio Canal, who now own the physical asset of that 1980 film, to come together and put a deal together.

King Features may be able to release comic based content, Universal still retains ownership of the Character since they have been involved with the Character since 1930s when they made serials.

 

[Jushin Thunder Liger]

Multiple people can own a character....Dreamworks/Mattel share ownership of She-ra.

This is true…

King Features may be able to release comic based content, Universal still retains ownership of the Character since they have been involved with the Character since 1930s when they made serials.

…but just like She-Ra, Universal doesn’t own Flash Gordon - they just own the film/TV rights, and even now, that may not be entirely accurate. (Marvel Productions, back when they existed, featured Flash on Defenders of the Earth, and another studio, the same one that did Phantom 2040, was able to make a Flash cartoon in the 90s.)

They didn’t create him, he was a work-for-hire that Hearst/King owns. The Universal serials, and the 1980 movie, were based on the comics, not the other way around.

 

[tielo]

The whole land is ripe for a re-theme asap imho.
Most of these characters aren't know to me or have any value. Universal has a ton of animated characters that could fit that island and would sell more merch.
And demolish Dudley and replace it with a better themed log ride and ride vehicles I can actually enter and exit.

 

[Paulio]

Problem is that Universal doesn't have any specific IP to replace the area from. Same goes for The Lost Continent, which is widely rumored to be the area for Zelda.

 

[Cup_Of_Coffee]

Problem is that Universal doesn't have any specific IP to replace the area from. Same goes for The Lost Continent, which is widely rumored to be the area for Zelda.

They could definitely do KFP in either TL or LC imo. Zelda can go to LC, then add some show for goodness sake in the TL Theatre. Preferably Demo’d for something legit.

 

[Mad Dog]

With all of the other priorities at USF, IOA and Epic, I would doubt anything major happening in regards to Popeye or Dudley for a long time.

 

[shiekra38]

Problem is that Universal doesn't have any specific IP to replace the area from. Same goes for The Lost Continent, which is widely rumored to be the area for Zelda.

I think Popeye and Dudley are iconic enough to carry their own torch

They're literally the best versions of their respective ride systems

Plus TL has the best theme park burger around (Wimpy's)

I believe the land will age gracefully

LC on the other hand feels like it exists to hold Hagrids queue

 

[Clive]

Dudley Do-Right is the best version of its ride system? We're saying that in a world where Splash Mountain (problematic elements notwithstanding) and the Timber Mountain Log Ride exist?

I'd be fine with Toon Lagoon staying mostly as-is if they bothered to maintain it. While Popeye has an incredible route, it's hard to defend its show quality at this point, which was one of the things that helped it stand so high above its competitors.

 

[shiekra38]

Dudley Do-Right is the best version of its ride system? We're saying that in a world where Splash Mountain (problematic elements notwithstanding) and the Timber Mountain Log Ride exist?

I'd be fine with Toon Lagoon staying mostly as-is if they bothered to maintain it. While Popeye has an incredible route, it's hard to defend its show quality at this point, which was one of the things that helped it stand so high above its competitors.

Dudley has always been better than Splash Mountain

Please forward all hate email to my secretary Beverly

 

[quinnmac000]

Ripsaw Falls is a better water ride while Splash is a better dark ride.

 

[sonoma15]

Ripsaw Falls in a better water ride while Splash is a better dark ride.

Agreed, Ripsaw Falls level layout with Splash Mountain level of theming would be the ultimate log flume.