Tenet

[wutisgood]

I assume this is going to be running quite a long time in a lot of theaters since there really isn't anything else on the Slate coming out. I have no doubt it will be a great movie as far as a action-packed original blockbuster type of thing is concerned. I am absolutely going to see this in theaters since Nolan films so much in Native IMAX. But I'm definitely going to wait a few weeks and try to pick a time in the middle of the week where there are only a few people in the theater. I would not see that as much of a risk at all.

I have a good surround setup engine projector at home but Christopher Nolan is right to film in IMAX primarily because I will never ever be able to afford close to that quality set up at home nor will I want to try. Even if even if I wanted to spend a lot on equipment there is no way really without actually getting an IMAX home theater to get the video in that format for viewing. Similarly I think Studios have almost no incentive to release 3D for home viewing anymore. I wish they would because I like viewing it on my projector but those people are only going to spend money for something no one uses it home and get more money from the people that want 3D that can only ever see it in that format when it's out in the theater.

I would suggest that everybody look at discount gift card sites like gift card wiki and buy cheap gift cards before purchasing tickets.

 

[OhHaiInternet95]

My god, people are acting like this movie has a 40-50% on the Tomatometer. Ridiculous.

Checked up on r/movies...what a bunch of pretentious you-know-whats.

 

[wutisgood]

My god, people are acting like this movie has a 40-50% on the Tomatometer. Ridiculous.

Checked up on r/movies...what a bunch of pretentious you-know-whats.

I feel like there is a parallel between the rise of anti reviewer type people and anti-intellectualism. I always viewed reviewers is doing a service by watching the movie first before I spend actual money to see it to tell me is it good and is it something that I might like. Now there are certainly reviewers that are terrible and reviewers that I don't agree with but I always find on average if most of them say a movie is good I like it. And for the movies I'm not sure about when I read deeper into the reviews I can get a good idea if it is something I want to spend money on personally. There are certainly a lot of great movies that are not a mass-market enjoyable kind of watch and I don't personally want to watch.

Without reviewers one is arguing that they would rather not be informed at all that they would rather give a studio money for creating a turd just because that studio spent money on a property or subject they liked.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Sounds like classic Nolan. Zero interest in this, or any Nolan movie (his Batman trilogy was trash, don't @ me.)

Ohh I'll @ you. You can't just clam some of the best comic book movies ever are trash

I want a list of reasons...the acting is solid, music fantastic, action great, Dark Knight has many tense moments the first time watching, its the best version of two face because its not just some magically he's crazy it shows a man become a villain, and joker is dark but hilarious.
Not in a way trash

 

[Legacy]

Ohh I'll @ you. You can't just clam some of the best comic book movies ever are trash

I want a list of reasons...the acting is solid, music fantastic, action great, Dark Knight has many tense moments the first time watching, its the best version of two face because its not just some magically he's crazy it shows a man become a villain, and joker is dark but hilarious.
Not in a way trash

Batman Begins survives because Christian Bale and Cillian Murphy give it their all (especially Cillian). The story itself is merely adequate though, and the third act “twist” of Ra’s al Ghul’s return is somehow both telegraphed and narratively undeserved while turning the villain we’ve spent most of the film with into a silly lackey.

Dark Knight is good simply because of how transcendent Heath Ledger is. Christian Bale is starting to phone it in. Narratively, its over-bloated, to the extent where the third act “twist” with Two-Face’s creation waste one of the best villains in the rogues gallery on a rushed, incoherent murder spree while shoving the story of the villain we’ve spent most of the film with off to the side in a whimper. (Seriously... how much better would it have been if the movie ended when Harvey turns his head to reveal the burned side of his face and the third movie is Batman dealing with Joker and Two-Face?)

Dark Knight Rises is confusing trash with no actually redeeming performances. The whole thing feels like Nolan just replaced Joker with Bane but didn’t bother with changing his planned plot. Stealing a nuclear reactor to blow up the city? Sending Gotham into a villain-led police state complete with kangaroo court? Those are Joker plots. Those aren’t Bane plots. Then, in the third act “twist,” Talía appears as both a telegraphed and undeserved reveal, turning the villain we’ve spent most of the film with into a silly lackey. Plus Catwoman is there... why?

Individual performances are the only reason people like them. It ain’t the plot or writing. They work well for Nolan because so much of the character development is already done for him across 80 years of comics. Fans automatically fill in the gaps.

 

[HalfGlass]

79% now....

I think people are very infatuated with him as a director...and despite his incredible skills as a filmmaker, he does keep staying with the same themes and tone, whether if he's making a period war movie, sci fi or action film. They’re usually brutally serious and deal with time manipulation. He really needs to do something different to break the mold at this point. Personally, I think a character piece would be ideal.

Now don’t get me wrong, I’ve enjoyed and outright loved pretty much every one of his films. But coming off of Memento, TDK trilogy, The Prestige and Inception, I was like “this man is the filmmaker of our generation, the new Spielberg in his universal acclaim”. But...then I had this thought surrounding his work.

I feel like Nolan is what a studio inventor made as their interpretation of a perfect filmmaking AI. Like, if they could create a director who could construct incredible action sequences, make stories that while confusing, are at least unique and people pleasers, break ground in extravagant, but not risky ways (i.e. dream sequences in Inception being mostly normal environments). Then manipulate the genres while staying mostly familiar to guarantee box office dollars.

But because he's an AI....he can never get human emotion right. His films always become about expositional dialogue detailing how complex his stories are while never creating characters that would actually exist in real life. Ultimately, even when rewatching a classic like The Dark Knight, you can feel this. Characters are constantly speaking to further the plot, explaining exactly what’s happening, but never in “human moments”, or at least rarely.

You don’t need to have character development as a centerpiece to every story, but you need to have some semblance of normal dialogue and interactions to make it believable.

 

[RevFreako]

Ohh I'll @ you. You can't just clam some of the best comic book movies ever are trash

I want a list of reasons...the acting is solid, music fantastic, action great, Dark Knight has many tense moments the first time watching, its the best version of two face because its not just some magically he's crazy it shows a man become a villain, and joker is dark but hilarious.
Not in a way trash

Buy me a coffee sometime and I'll give you my forty-five minute rap on the subject.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Batman Begins survives because Christian Bale and Cillian Murphy give it their all (especially Cillian). The story itself is merely adequate though, and the third act “twist” of Ra’s al Ghul’s return is somehow both telegraphed and narratively undeserved while turning the villain we’ve spent most of the film with into a silly lackey.

Dark Knight is good simply because of how transcendent Heath Ledger is. Christian Bale is starting to phone it in. Narratively, its over-bloated, to the extent where the third act “twist” with Two-Face’s creation waste one of the best villains in the rogues gallery on a rushed, incoherent murder spree while shoving the story of the villain we’ve spent most of the film with off to the side in a whimper. (Seriously... how much better would it have been if the movie ended when Harvey turns his head to reveal the burned side of his face and the third movie is Batman dealing with Joker and Two-Face?)

Dark Knight Rises is confusing trash with no actually redeeming performances. The whole thing feels like Nolan just replaced Joker with Bane but didn’t bother with changing his planned plot. Stealing a nuclear reactor to blow up the city? Sending Gotham into a villain-led police state complete with kangaroo court? Those are Joker plots. Those aren’t Bane plots. Then, in the third act “twist,” Talía appears as both a telegraphed and undeserved reveal, turning the villain we’ve spent most of the film with into a silly lackey. Plus Catwoman is there... why?

Individual performances are the only reason people like them. It ain’t the plot or writing. They work well for Nolan because so much of the character development is already done for him across 80 years of comics. Fans automatically fill in the gaps.

You don't seem to like Super Hero films then

No one watches them for the Story's its the acting and cast that bring these characters to life. Infinity War is amazing..but because the story? Not its the acting

So to throw out the cast killing it in the first two batman films and be like they aren't that great event if they are acted well, shot well and the scores are amazing is to me a joke. Joker wasn't big until this film its what made him main stream because of how well Heath killed the part with his physical acting and facial expressions.
I agree Knight Rises is a mess, mainly because its not the original ending it was going to be like Silents of the Lamb with Riddle outsmarting batman and batman having to ask Joker for help to defeat him, which would have been a way better film than strong man you can't understand with bomb

 

[RevFreako]

Joker wasn't big until this film its what made him main stream

Correction, you're going to have to buy me a hell of a lot more than a coffee before I'm willing to talk Batman with you.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Correction, you're going to have to buy me a hell of a lot more than a coffee before I'm willing to talk Batman with you.

Super Hero's were being mainstream then...Spiderman was he start of it (yes the Batman 90s movies were big but nothing compared to what they are now where everyone watches these films)
Joker became huge after this film like Harley became mainstream after Suicide Squad, of course Joker was big with comic fans before this (animated series and killing joke)
But main stream? Comic book movies didn't become cool until around Avengers, I grew up in the 90s and they were not cool back then....god I wish they were but they were not.

 

[RevFreako]

Super Hero's were being mainstream then...Spiderman was he start of it (yes the Batman 90s movies were big but nothing compared to what they are now where everyone watches these films)
Joker became huge after this film like Harley became mainstream after Suicide Squad, of course Joker was big with comic fans before this (animated series and killing joke)
But main stream? Comic book movies didn't become cool until around Avengers, I grew up in the 90s and they were not cool back then....god I wish they were but they were not.

Cesar Romero and Jack Nicholson say hi.

 

[Mad Dog]

Cesar Romero and Jack Nicholson say hi.

yes....especially Nicholson. There was publicity galore about the character when he played him. People forget, or weren't old enough at the time. Nicholson as the Joker was a 'huge' deal back then....And the Batman TV series at first, though campy as all hell, received TV ratings that only premier sports championships get today. Many many millions watched those shows, and they were on a couple days a week at first, the ratings were so large.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Cesar Romero and Jack Nicholson say hi.

No disrespect the guys did a good job with the characters, but comic's were not main stream until late 2000's.

I'm not saying Character's weren't popular but There are a million Why so Serious Tattoos and car decals than those two version of the character combined.

Once again I'm saying nolans Films help made Super Hero's cool and main stream....like back int he 90s you were a nerd if you read xmen, girls might have read comics but they weren't wearing t shirts with characters on them and Comic con was not big until around Avengers. That's what I'm saying if you disagree fine but I went to comic con before Disney bought the MCU it was not as well attended and not even close to as big because comic books became main stream because of The Dark Knight, Spiderman and the MCU making them into where everyone enjoys comic characters.

 

[RevFreako]

No disrespect the guys did a good job with the characters, but comic's were not main stream until late 2000's.

I'm not saying Character's weren't popular but There are a million Why so Serious Tattoos and car decals than those two version of the character combined.

Once again I'm saying nolans Films help made Super Hero's cool and main stream....like back int he 90s you were a nerd if you read xmen, girls might have read comics but they weren't wearing t shirts with characters on them and Comic con was not big until around Avengers. That's what I'm saying if you disagree fine but I went to comic con before Disney bought the MCU it was not as well attended and not even close to as big because comic books became main stream because of The Dark Knight, Spiderman and the MCU making them into where everyone enjoys comic characters.

Okay, buddy. Raimi's Spider-Man, wossname's X-Men and Blade were what made comic book movies mainstream (for the third or fourth time, learn your history) -- that wave was already cresting by the time Nolan came along. His trilogy, for whatever I think of it, deserves credit for helping that along, but he sure as eff wasn't the author of it - nor did he "make Joker mainstream." Cesar Romero and Nicholson did more on that score than Nolan/Ledger did, and that's just the reality.

 

[Legacy]

You don't seem to like Super Hero films then

No one watches them for the Story's its the acting and cast that bring these characters to life. Infinity War is amazing..but because the story? Not its the acting

So to throw out the cast killing it in the first two batman films and be like they aren't that great event if they are acted well, shot well and the scores are amazing is to me a joke. Joker wasn't big until this film its what made him main stream because of how well Heath killed the part with his physical acting and facial expressions.
I agree Knight Rises is a mess, mainly because its not the original ending it was going to be like Silents of the Lamb with Riddle outsmarting batman and batman having to ask Joker for help to defeat him, which would have been a way better film than strong man you can't understand with bomb

I love superhero movies. The movie coming out in the next couple of years I’m actually most excited for is actually The Batman, followed very closely by Thor: Love and Thunder. But I also expect them to have interesting, engaging stories with character development. Into the Spiderverse, Black Panther, Incredibles, Logan, Big Hero Six... shoot even Tim Burton’s Batman, run narrative circles around any of Nolan’s Batman films. And they’re proof that you can (nay, should) have a half-decent story for your superhero movies. Hugh Jackman tried his hardest in Days of Future Past. It had some of the best actors available and was competently made. The story was crap though.

No disrespect the guys did a good job with the characters, but comic's were not main stream until late 2000's.

I'm not saying Character's weren't popular but There are a million Why so Serious Tattoos and car decals than those two version of the character combined.

Once again I'm saying nolans Films help made Super Hero's cool and main stream....like back int he 90s you were a nerd if you read xmen, girls might have read comics but they weren't wearing t shirts with characters on them and Comic con was not big until around Avengers. That's what I'm saying if you disagree fine but I went to comic con before Disney bought the MCU it was not as well attended and not even close to as big because comic books became main stream because of The Dark Knight, Spiderman and the MCU making them into where everyone enjoys comic characters.

Popular media in the 90s revolved around Batman, X-Men, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, and Power Rangers. All superheroes. Blade came out in ‘98. The X-Men came out in 2000. Spider-Man was 2002.

Those 80s/90s kids (hi) have, unlike previous generations, dragged a lot of the things they loved as children with them into adulthood. They’re willing to un-ironically publicly claim their fandom. Batman and the Joker were ALREADY popular. It wasn’t Nolan. Blade, Raimi’s Spider-Man, and Iron Man did far to push superhero movies along because they actually proved good movies with (at the time) “lesser” characters could succeed.

 

[OhHaiInternet95]

I love superhero movies. The movie coming out in the next couple of years I’m actually most excited for is actually The Batman, followed very closely by Thor: Love and Thunder. But I also expect them to have interesting, engaging stories with character development. Into the Spiderverse, Black Panther, Incredibles, Logan, Big Hero Six... shoot even Tim Burton’s Batman, run narrative circles around any of Nolan’s Batman films. And they’re proof that you can (nay, should) have a half-decent story for your superhero movies. Hugh Jackman tried his hardest in Days of Future Past. It had some of the best actors available and was competently made. The story was crap though.

Popular media in the 90s revolved around Batman, X-Men, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, and Power Rangers. All superheroes. Blade came out in ‘98. The X-Men came out in 2000. Spider-Man was 2002.

Those 80s/90s kids (hi) have, unlike previous generations, dragged a lot of the things they loved as children with them into adulthood. They’re willing to un-ironically publicly claim their fandom. Batman and the Joker were ALREADY popular. It wasn’t Nolan. Blade, Raimi’s Spider-Man, and Iron Man did far to push superhero movies along because they actually proved good movies with (at the time) “lesser” characters could succeed.

Love Incredibles and Raimi's trilogy, really really like Days of Future Past and Into the Spiderverse. Logan was a great movie too, but it was so hard for me to watch (Patrick Stewart's performance in particular messed me up). Black Panther had some cool visuals and the villain's motivation was interesting, but I just wasn't into it for whatever reason. Enjoyed BH6...when it was just Hiro and Baymax (so first 30 mins), but still overrated.

 

[Jerroddragon]

I love superhero movies. The movie coming out in the next couple of years I’m actually most excited for is actually The Batman, followed very closely by Thor: Love and Thunder. But I also expect them to have interesting, engaging stories with character development. Into the Spiderverse, Black Panther, Incredibles, Logan, Big Hero Six... shoot even Tim Burton’s Batman, run narrative circles around any of Nolan’s Batman films. And they’re proof that you can (nay, should) have a half-decent story for your superhero movies. Hugh Jackman tried his hardest in Days of Future Past. It had some of the best actors available and was competently made. The story was crap though.

Popular media in the 90s revolved around Batman, X-Men, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, and Power Rangers. All superheroes. Blade came out in ‘98. The X-Men came out in 2000. Spider-Man was 2002.

Those 80s/90s kids (hi) have, unlike previous generations, dragged a lot of the things they loved as children with them into adulthood. They’re willing to un-ironically publicly claim their fandom. Batman and the Joker were ALREADY popular. It wasn’t Nolan. Blade, Raimi’s Spider-Man, and Iron Man did far to push superhero movies along because they actually proved good movies with (at the time) “lesser” characters could succeed.

I mean to each his own but while I like the burton films for what they are...the man never even read a batman comic before making them and did his version rather than explore Batman as a character. So anyone can argue i guess about what a good film is but Bruce is in now way the same person from Batman Begins to Dark Knight, he grows a poop ton in the first two films. Two Face is one of the best comic book arcs out there because you get to see him become a villain and given time.

Its kinda insane to see so many hate on two of the best two comic book movies out there, especially with the crappy late 90 movies and Justice League we have seen what crappy Batman films look like and the first two Nolan films are in no way bad, especially for when they came out (15 and 12 years ago) If Ironman gets a pass for a really meh villain then these films should get whatever small mehs you people see in them but the acting isn't bad, the soundtracks are great, the storys as basic but good and there are for sure themes in both films about fear, humans and the nature of evil. Along with Dark knight having the amazing truck scene which is all physical no clue what you guys are trying to pull being like its not great.

 

[Legacy]

Here’s the thing, though. Burton wanted to make a good movie; not a good Batman movie. And he accomplishes that in spades. It set the standard for superhero movies for a over a decade. We can talk about how bad Batman Forever and Batman and Robin were, but at least they were fun (and Val Kilmer is my favorite Batman, currently). Apart of Scarecrow and Joker, the Nolan films are mirthless, super-cereal bores that literally established “grim dark” as a comic book genre.

If you notice, I didn’t mention Iron Man as a paragon of quality. Nor Blade or Spider-Man. But they were successful. And success and quality are not directly related.

You mention the truck scene In TDK. As spectacle, it’s amazing. But Birdman’s one-shot set is an amazing spectacle too. As was the final battle in Infinity War. Spectacle does not a good movie make.

I return to my original point about “concepts” being Nolan’s top priority before story or character. That truck scene was based around the visual of a flipping truck, and its a go-to. Naming a quality, memorable scene in the movie that isn’t pure spectacle or Heath Ledger is near impossible. Naming moments of scenes across the whole trilogy that isn’t pure spectacle or Heath Ledger is still difficult. That’s not the sign of quality storytelling. And again, the conclusion of Harvey Dent’s arc is a rushed, muddled affair. The story and character development isn’t good.

Christopher Nolan wanted to film Dunkirk without a script. The protagonist in Tenant is literally called “The Protagonist.” His intentional sound-mixing that overpowered dialogue was so ineffective people thought there was an actual problem with the film. He has made and continues to make decisions that prioritize the spectacle over storytelling. His Batman films are no different.

 

[Jerroddragon]

Here’s the thing, though. Burton wanted to make a good movie; not a good Batman movie. And he accomplishes that in spades. It set the standard for superhero movies for a over a decade. We can talk about how bad Batman Forever and Batman and Robin were, but at least they were fun (and Val Kilmer is my favorite Batman, currently). Apart of Scarecrow and Joker, the Nolan films are mirthless, super-cereal bores that literally established “grim dark” as a comic book genre.

If you notice, I didn’t mention Iron Man as a paragon of quality. Nor Blade or Spider-Man. But they were successful. And success and quality are not directly related.

You mention the truck scene In TDK. As spectacle, it’s amazing. But Birdman’s one-shot set is an amazing spectacle too. As was the final battle in Infinity War. Spectacle does not a good movie make.

I return to my original point about “concepts” being Nolan’s top priority before story or character. That truck scene was based around the visual of a flipping truck, and its a go-to. Naming a quality, memorable scene in the movie that isn’t pure spectacle or Heath Ledger is near impossible. Naming moments of scenes across the whole trilogy that isn’t pure spectacle or Heath Ledger is still difficult. That’s not the sign of quality storytelling. And again, the conclusion of Harvey Dent’s arc is a rushed, muddled affair. The story and character development isn’t good.

Christopher Nolan wanted to film Dunkirk without a script. The protagonist in Tenant is literally called “The Protagonist.” His intentional sound-mixing that overpowered dialogue was so ineffective people thought there was an actual problem with the film. He has made and continues to make decisions that prioritize the spectacle over storytelling. His Batman films are no different.

Errr I guess once again your discounting Aaron Eckhart amazing Two face arc, Liam Neeson I think played Ra really well, and Christian Bale i think does really great work in the Begins and good in the sequel. I never not enjoy putting those two films on but once again each there own. I think they are top notch super hero films and have more going for them than against them

 

[Legacy]

Errr I guess once again your discounting Aaron Eckhart amazing Two face arc, Liam Neeson I think played Ra really well, and Christian Bale i think does really great work in the Begins and good in the sequel. I never not enjoy putting those two films on but once again each there own. I think they are top notch super hero films and have more going for them than against them

I’m a huge Aaron Eckhart fan, and thought he did fine. I also don’t think he was given a lot. Liam Neeson is basically channeling Qui-Gon Jinn whenever he’s on screen.