Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[JungleSkip]

Models, even.

>

rivate:

Excuse me. I have a soundstage to infiltrate

 

[Sam Hill]

If it’s helpful for anyone to see the new deeds in question, I can provide. They do have a legal description of boundaries, exclusions, and recorded easements, etc.

 

[JoeCamel]

rivate:

Excuse me. I have a soundstage to infiltrate

Wear a pair of these

 

[zg44]

Universal owned this land before, and I'm sure there was a plan to develop it.
I'm wondering how far those plans where ready and if anything from that design will make it over to the current development. If the past is any indication an idea never gets lost and finds it way into new rides.

A lot of stuff like the arrangement and dimensions of theme park(s) and hotels could could carry over. That's very logical to imagine because many of the parcels have estimated numbers of potential hotel rooms and such. Of course, those estimates change when you design an actual hotel to fit the land (as we saw with WnW having its estimated 4000 hotel rooms reduced to 2800).

Vivendi originally planned to build 2 parks, 10000 hotel rooms, hundreds of timeshares, some golf courses, and a major shopping district with 2 million+ sq footage of retail. (Remove the timeshares and you have a list of what Comcast-owned Universal would build, it's not that different).

I'm sure the locations of much of that will carry over into the modern plans simply because of the obviousness of it: When you have 450-500 acres of theme park allocated space; well you'll naturally fill that with the allocations for 2 dry theme parks, 1 water park, CityWalk 2.0 and a couple of premium hotels. That's going to take up all of that space in an obvious sense, even if there are slight differences between how a cash-rich Comcast-owned Universal would act versus a cash-poor Vivendi/Blackstone-owned Universal.

The main difference is simply that Comcast-owned Universal will go big and probably allocate a total spend of $6-7 billion to developing the property over 20 years. Vivendi was probably going to do that at a relative cost at least 75% lower in real terms (adjusting for the fact that Vivendi would have started 1.5 decades ago in inflation terms). That's the difference that having a rich corporate parent makes.

 

[Teebin]

So one would assume there are models of Mario and SLOP and possibly concepts for park central icons. Anything else anyone can think of?

 

[JungleSkip]

So one would assume there are models of Mario and SLOP and possibly concepts for park central icons. Anything else anyone can think of?

If LOTR is indeed in the mix, I’d imagine that’s modeled up as well

 

[quinnmac000]

The Nile Egyptian Resort Model too

 

[JungleSkip]

The Nile Egyptian Resort Model too

If only

 

[ReelJustice]

Catching up as I enjoy some coffee outside by my fire pit.

Direct rail from MCO would be amazing (if far fetched).

I could also see the Kirkman extension being moved over to the western edge which would result in a straighter path and more efficient land use for Universal.

 

[Disneyhead]

I know that.

A lot still is going to go into this. You don't rush an entirely new theme park resort is my point. I also don't see real construction beginning until next year and theme parks always take at least three years to build.

So like I said, is 2022 possible? Yes. But I wouldn't get my hopes up. I'm expecting this no sooner than 2023 so if we do happen to get it earlier, it'll be a nice treat.

Pretty sure they have the layout of the resort locked down. So I would imagine they will start with that (rerouting/creating waterways, installing infrastructure, building road beds, etc.) ASAP.

 

[Nick]

Pretty sure they have the layout of the resort locked down. So I would imagine they will start with that (rerouting/creating waterways, installing infrastructure, building road beds, etc.) ASAP.

Again, I haven't denied that they know exactly what the resort will look like. My point is that it doesn't happen overnight. This is going to take quite a bit of time, even with them knowing everything right now.

I'm simply saying I'm expecting 2023 - if it's before then, awesome.

 

[Frank Drackman]

I would guess that Comcast has had UC working on plans for what, about five years now?

They knew they would find the land. Rides and areas could be used regardless of what skins/dressings/IPs they have. So they could be just changed if they didn't get an IP.

I imagine they have been working with the city somewhat with this, at least enough to know how tough/long any approvals would take.

I imagine access (turnpike/highway exit) and transport between parks would need to be planned early on.

I have no guess on how quick they could start nor any idea of when we could expect softs...but I imagine these boards will be more lively for years to come.

 

[s8film40]

Direct rail from MCO would be amazing (if far fetched).

The thing that makes this feasible to me is that it could also serve the convention center. Of course a rail line serving the bulk of the tourists in that area would reduce the traffic on 528 and in turn reduce the profitability of those new expensive toll lanes. Also Disney and other businesses wouldn't probably like it. So there's probably a lot of politics to overcome.

 

[tidecat]

Depending on the current traffic levels on SR 528, putting in direct rail may make more sense than trying to expand the road. One would have to expect that if Universal adds 1-3 new parks, there will be incremental growth in the number of visitors to the Orlando area, in addition to the massive population growth from Puerto Ricans who moved to Florida after last year’s hurricanes.

There’s also no reason Disney couldn’t be involved, although Disney would likely have to shoulder more of the costs for anything outside Orlando/Orange County. Brightline already is planning service to from Cocoa to Orlando along this corridor, and there apparently is at least one other private sector proposal for train service along this corridor as well. Universal (and Disney) may be able to sit back and let others build this out for them - if those ventures go under, it could be a reasonably priced acquisition.

 

[Magic-Man]

Models, even.

>

opcorn:

 

[Disneyhead]

The thing that makes this feasible to me is that it could also serve the convention center. Of course a rail line serving the bulk of the tourists in that area would reduce the traffic on 528 and in turn reduce the profitability of those new expensive toll lanes. Also Disney and other businesses wouldn't probably like it. So there's probably a lot of politics to overcome.

They need to run an Attractions Express (elevated train) down the 528/I-4 from MCO to Disney with stops at the AMTRAK/Sunrail crossover, OCCC (OCCC, Universal, SeaWorld, I-Drive) and Disney.

And connect the north end of the 429 to I-4.

 

[JoeCamel]

They need to run an Attractions Express (elevated train) down the 528/I-4 from MCO to Disney with stops at the AMTRAK/Sunrail crossover, OCCC (OCCC, Universal, SeaWorld, I-Drive) and Disney.

And connect the north end of the 429 to I-4.

I can hear the screams coming from the Mears corporate offices now....

 

[Scott W.]

I would guess that Comcast has had UC working on plans for what, about five years now?

They knew they would find the land. Rides and areas could be used regardless of what skins/dressings/IPs they have. So they could be just changed if they didn't get an IP.

I imagine they have been working with the city somewhat with this, at least enough to know how tough/long any approvals would take.

I imagine access (turnpike/highway exit) and transport between parks would need to be planned early on.

I have no guess on how quick they could start nor any idea of when we could expect softs...but I imagine these boards will be more lively for years to come.

I'd say a lot longer than. Remember, that Universal used to own a good chunk of this land but Vivendi sold it off.

 

[zg44]

Last year, I wrote this:
If I had to design an "odds of when the next gate opens", it'd look something like this:

2021: 10% odds
2022: 20% odds (cumulative 30%)
2023: 40% odds (cumulative 70%)
2024: 15% odds (cumulative 85%)
2025: 10% odds (cumulative 95%)
2026 or later: 5% odds

If I had to update that due to the land situation becoming clear/legal issues ending (and another year passing), I'd say it looks more like this now:

2022: 20% odds
2023: 60% odds (cumulative 80%)
2024: 15% odds (cumulative 95%)
2025: 4% odds (cumulative 99%)
2026 or later: 1% odds


2021 is off the board now because a 3 year buildout from here is unrealistic in this day-and-age (yeah I know it was done decades ago, but building regulations and such are much more comprehensive these days).

Basically, 2023 seems like the year based on a 5 year land preparation+buildout, but there's a possibility that they still aim for 2022. The only reason it would end up in 2024 or later is because of delays; it's hard to see them pushing the project off beyond those dates, especially if they're saving Super Nintendo World for the 3rd dry park.

 

[Disneyhead]

I could see some hotels and parts of CityWalk 2.0 opening in 2022.