Wizarding World - Diagon Alley Discussion (Opens 2014)

[Frogki]

Put in a great new darkride in place of Sinbad, refurb PF, do some general TLC, and I think it could be fixed. Or it could be replaced. I would just rather see a new property rather than Potter engulf it.

But I honestly think that was the plan all along. Why take the more popular half of one island but leave the other half? Seriously, I've been to IoA numerous times, and LC's been empty everytime aside from Dueling Dragons and straggling shoppers.
Everyone seems to be laboring under (in my opinion) a delusion that LC will stay for nostalgic's sake and Uni won't use Potter for "originality's sake".
I mean, I just don't know why you don't think HP could or should replace LC. It's extremely popular, it's not going anywhere for a long while. It already took over the better half of the island...

--- Update ---

You say it would be very easy, but it wouldn't. A full Potter take over of LC would cost many times that of the first incarnation, excluding FJ. They tore down virtually nothing: Only the Enchanted Oak facade. The kitchens stayed, the bathrooms stayed, the DC and FotH queues stayed. All they built new was FJ and the Hogsmeade facades. Now for a take over of the rest of LC, that would require tearing down the entire PF facade and the Mythos facade, probably leaving the kitchen and bathrooms, and most likely tearing down Sindbad and all the little shops and buildings in the Bazaar. Plus the Mystic Fountain with all its plumbing. Then building whatever they might plan on building. Whatever a Potter expansion might be, it would not be cheap or easy.

I don't mean to put it that way. It wouldn't be easy. But as Uni's seen, if you build they will come, I don't understand how you can't see that.

 

[jtsalien]

You say it would be very easy, but it wouldn't. A full Potter take over of LC would cost many times that of the first incarnation, excluding FJ. They tore down virtually nothing: Only the Enchanted Oak facade. The kitchens stayed, the bathrooms stayed, the DC and FotH queues stayed. All they built new was FJ and the Hogsmeade facades. Now for a take over of the rest of LC, that would require tearing down the entire PF facade and the Mythos facade, probably leaving the kitchen and bathrooms, and most likely tearing down Sindbad and all the little shops and buildings in the Bazaar. Plus the Mystic Fountain with all its plumbing. Then building whatever they might plan on building. Whatever a Potter expansion might be, it would not be cheap or easy.

That's very true. Didn't think about that. I'm sure something like PF would not be cheap to quick to tear down. Would all this extra cost be worth it in the end? Idk. I just don't see Phase 1 profits repeating themselves. Universal should shock people again. Make them NEED to come back to IOA.

 

[Jymmymack]

Alright. What other property shall we base an entire land on? LOTR? What ride would you have? Frodo's March? Star Wars? Taken. Indiana Jones? Taken. Pirates of the Caribbean? Pretty sure that's taken. Jurassic Park? Right next door. Comic book heroes? Right next door. Cartoons? You guessed it. How about a Shel Silverstein land? Yeah, you could see the Giving Tree and take a ride over the edge of where the sidewalk ends. Let's be realistic folks. You have a contract to license the most popular franchise in the world. In that license, you are required to make an expansion which would represent all of the series after the final film is released. You have an expansion concept that comes pre-designed with shops and a roller coaster dark ride experience. Are you telling me that you would say no, especially when the section in question has single-handedly led to a 30%+ increase in ticket sales and god knows how much money in merchandise?

 

[mantaguy]

^^ And similarly, I fail to see how people can delude themselves into thinking the Lost Continent is a bad island. It is very true that it lost a great part of itself, but right now it has two quality attractions (not to mention the only show IoA has), a fantastic restaurant, many specialty shops that no other park in Orlando has, and most of all, amazing themed architecture. To me it embodies one aspect of adventure that none of the others have: being larger than life. The mere fact that it is now overshadowed by Potter is the only reason people complain about it.

^ I feel we must delve a little deaper into this Gingotts idea. Obviously what would happen is we go into the vault system on a coaster mine train. But why are we there? To withdraw money? Muggles don't have accounts. To steal something? Why are we being thrown into this mess? It's a great idea on the exterior, but the meat this kind of ride needs is not there.

 

[JungleSkip]

^^ And similarly, I fail to see how people can delude themselves into thinking the Lost Continent is a bad island. It is very true that it lost a great part of itself, but right now it has two quality attractions (not to mention the only show IoA has), a fantastic restaurant, many specialty shops that no other park in Orlando has, and most of all, amazing themed architecture. To me it embodies one aspect of adventure that none of the others have: being larger than life. The mere fact that it is now overshadowed by Potter is the only reason people complain about it.

Calling Sinbad a quality attraction? Now that's deluded

 

[jtsalien]

^^ And similarly, I fail to see how people can delude themselves into thinking the Lost Continent is a bad island. It is very true that it lost a great part of itself, but right now it has two quality attractions (not to mention the only show IoA has), a fantastic restaurant, many specialty shops that no other park in Orlando has, and most of all, amazing themed architecture. To me it embodies one aspect of adventure that none of the others have: being larger than life. The mere fact that it is now overshadowed by Potter is the only reason people complain about it.

I think that's the most important part. Sure, Sinbad is aging, but IOA needs shows. Theme parks need shows. I think IOA would be hurt by the loss of that. And I'm sorry, no one who isn't a Potter fan would sit through a Potter show if they made one. Who says LC needs a property anyway? It never had one before when it was once considered universally great.

 

[Frogki]

^^ And similarly, I fail to see how people can delude themselves into thinking the Lost Continent is a bad island. It is very true that it lost a great part of itself, but right now it has two quality attractions (not to mention the only show IoA has), a fantastic restaurant, many specialty shops that no other park in Orlando has, and most of all, amazing themed architecture. To me it embodies one aspect of adventure that none of the others have: being larger than life. The mere fact that it is now overshadowed by Potter is the only reason people complain about it.

No mantaguy, trust me, I felt this way before Potter. The whole island is falling apart, I have always just skipped everything besides Dueling Dragons there because it's a dieing island and I never saw any reason to go in (that was before I got obsessive like you guys :inquisitive: ). It just doesn't have anything to offer to the average guest anymore.

--- Update ---

I think that's the most important part. Sure, Sinbad is aging, but IOA needs shows. Theme parks need shows. I think IOA would be hurt by the loss of that. And I'm sorry, no one who isn't a Potter fan would sit through a Potter show if they made one. Who says LC needs a property anyway? It never had one before when it was once considered universally great.

Why would IoA be hurt by that. In fact, I don't think it would have much effect. Don't kid yourself - most guests go for the rides. Sure, I absolutely ADORE the Beattlejuice (excuse the spelling) show. But I go for the rides, and if we miss it, it isn't a huge disappointment.
Not that another show couldn't be incorporated - there are plenty of opportunities throughout the park. But you're now defending the LC by saying that IoA needs shows... Ermm... Yeah, show can be in other islands for one thing. And who says people who aren't huge Potter fans wouldn't sit through a show? They squeeze in the shops without even knowing what they're buying don't they?

 

[JungleSkip]

I think that's the most important part. Sure, Sinbad is aging, but IOA needs shows. Theme parks need shows. I think IOA would be hurt by the loss of that. And I'm sorry, no one who isn't a Potter fan would sit through a Potter show if they made one. Who says LC needs a property anyway? It never had one before when it was once considered universally great.

If Uni could put together a quality stage show I would agree. But they can't. Gimme more rides

No one watches sinbad anyway

 

[Scarletwebslingr]

I think that's the most important part. Sure, Sinbad is aging, but IOA needs shows. Theme parks need shows. I think IOA would be hurt by the loss of that. And I'm sorry, no one who isn't a Potter fan would sit through a Potter show if they made one. Who says LC needs a property anyway? It never had one before when it was once considered universally great.

Are you really comparing the attendance of a Harry Potter stage show to Sinbad? Harry Potter's name on ANYTHING is going to pull people in. Sinbad's name will do little more than bring back memories of the 80's comedian. Lost Continent, as it stands, had one of the worst shows and attractions I've ever seen in a theme/amusement park. Mythos has the most weight on the Island and that can easily be rethemed with the same good, award-winning food. Potter for the win!

 

[jtsalien]

If Uni could put together a quality stage show I would agree. But they can't. Gimme more rides

No one watches sinbad anyway

Beetlejuice and Horror Make Up are pretty good quality shows.

 

[Scarletwebslingr]

Beetlejuice and Horror Make Up are pretty good quality shows.

Beetlejuice is terrible. Nostalgic, but terrible. Making a show centered around pop culture is always a bad idea. It becomes outdated far too quickly. Got to hand it to HMU though.

 

[Frogki]

Beetlejuice and Horror Make Up are pretty good quality shows.

Yes they are. But great shows do not a theme park make - great rides are what draw crowds.
I'm not knocking another show, I'm just saying that they don't need Sinbad, one of their worst shows. They don't need any shows, really, to draw a crowd. What you need is epic rides... (Or another great walkthrough attraction!)

 

[jtsalien]

Are you really comparing the attendance of a Harry Potter stage show to Sinbad? Harry Potter's name on ANYTHING is going to pull people in. Sinbad's name will do little more than bring back memories of the 80's comedian. Lost Continent, as it stands, had one of the worst shows and attractions I've ever seen in a theme/amusement park. Mythos has the most weight on the Island and that can easily be rethemed with the same good, award-winning food. Potter for the win!

No. I'm saying mythology stunt show vs. Potter show, mythology wins. And even if someone who isn't a Potter fan watches the show, they won't go back again. Plus it will never happen. JK will never allow face characters in the park like that.

 

[JungleSkip]

Beetlejuice and Horror Make Up are pretty good quality shows.

Beetlejuice is awful. Horror Make Up is good, but it also heavily benefits from the intimate setting

 

[Jymmymack]

I never said LC was a bad island. I said it's not a COMPLETE island. It's half an island. Half an idea. But obviously this is just going to go around and around. I can guarantee you nobody in the upper echelons of Comcast is taking a look at what they bought and saying, "No, don't expand Potter. Lost Continent is so original. We can't lose it. Let's put $60-100 million into restoring and updating it." That's just not how the world works.

 

[JungleSkip]

And even if someone who isn't a Potter fan watches the show, they won't go back again. Plus it will never happen.

That's better than no one ever going into Sinbad

 

[Jymmymack]

Beetlejuice and Horror Make Up are pretty good quality shows.

REALLY? HMU is a ton of fun, but Beetlejuise is flat out awful. So, just for the record, Potter=bad, Beetlejuice= good. Got it.

 

[Skipper Justin]

^^ And similarly, I fail to see how people can delude themselves into thinking the Lost Continent is a bad island. It is very true that it lost a great part of itself, but right now it has two quality attractions (not to mention the only show IoA has), a fantastic restaurant, many specialty shops that no other park in Orlando has, and most of all, amazing themed architecture. To me it embodies one aspect of adventure that none of the others have: being larger than life. The mere fact that it is now overshadowed by Potter is the only reason people complain about it.

^ I feel we must delve a little deaper into this Gingotts idea. Obviously what would happen is we go into the vault system on a coaster mine train. But why are we there? To withdraw money? Muggles don't have accounts. To steal something? Why are we being thrown into this mess? It's a great idea on the exterior, but the meat this kind of ride needs is not there.

Amazing themed architecture? I agree that PF and Mythos both look great but the Arabian section at this point looks like a bad Aladdin themed carnival. All that is left is Sinbad(Great Show? not really) and terrible midway games. The Greek side while looking good does not offer much. PF is an okay attraction but most of the guests that decide to go to it think it is a ride. The dialogue is cheesy, the acting is very hit and miss, and overall other than having a couple of cool moments (water vortex, water effects at the end) it is very forgettable. LC was a great idea and concept when the parks first opened, and like many other people on the board, I think it is a dying myth itself. There is almost no cohesion in the land(Greek to Arabian), and the attractions don't attract much attention. Harry Potter has been a shot of adrenaline for Universal, and LC, while I do hold fond memories for it, is mostly a snooze fest. Universal if they expand Harry Potter gives a chance for the fans and normal guests a like to experience even more of the Wizarding World. While some may argue that there would be no logical way in which to connect the two( Diagon Alley and Hogsmeade), I believe that after seeing what Universal Creative can do, they can find a way. I mean The Wizarding World is full of magic.

 

[jtsalien]

Geez calm down. Okay, maybe I pushed it with the inclusion of Beetlejuice . But people flock to it.

And I don't feel like being attacked anymore, so I'm done. But I won't back down from my opinion. Universal will be going in the wrong direction with more Potter. They have an opportunity to expand their name, and flex their muscle, and they are probably going to miss out on it. They have the chance to show people they are about more than Potter, but they won't. They'll stick to trying to print money with Potter. People's expectations will be through the roof, and it will fail in the public eye. It will not boast attendance 30%. People won't love Mythos as much anymore. Universal will go back to the drawing board again. That's my prediction, and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Frogki]

Geez calm down. Okay, maybe I pushed it with the inclusion of Beetlejuice . But people flock to it.

And I don't feel like being attacked anymore, so I'm done. But I won't back down from my opinion. Universal will be going in the wrong direction with more Potter. They have an opportunity to expand their name, and flex their muscle, and they are probably going to miss out on it. They have the chance to show people they are about more than Potter, but they won't. They'll stick to trying to print money with Potter. People's expectations will be through the roof, and it will fail in the public eye. It will not boast attendance 30%. People won't love Mythos as much anymore. Universal will go back to the drawing board again. That's my prediction, and I'm sticking to it.

Like I said, they AREN'T just about Potter. They will show people that - in due time of course. Potter's the baby right now so they're going to spoil it, once it's fabulous childhood days are over, the rest of the park will receive a lot of TLC, and we'll get more cool new stuff. You seem to be worrying that finishing Potter up will be a mistake, but in actuality, it's finishing a job (that people expect them to do) and then getting back to the rest of the park. Potter's priority right now - then we'll get IoA TLC and (with luck) more cool new stuff!